Batman Forever Re-edited, would it make a real difference?

[Keatonfan#1]

But actually Jett is right Batman Forever was a better film than its prequel Batman Returns, Forever was more loyal to Batman.

Also Bob Kane stated in "Cinescape" magazine that of all the actors who played Batman, he felt that Val Kilmer did it the best.

[Keatonfan#1]

But don't get me wrong I liked Batman Returns I thought it was ok but I find Batman Forever more enjoyable also Batman Forever has more action scenes than Batman Returns had.

[Keatonfan#1]

As for BATMAN RETURNS....
Coming from a pure Bat-fan standpoint, there's simply too much I don't like about that movie, starting with the weak "Penguin for Mayor" storyline. i just dont buy the fact that everyone accepts this obviously crazy guy as a mayoral candidate. and speaking of the penguin, the fact that he's depicted as a deformed freak doesnt work for me at all. the dude actually acts like a penguin, which is really stupid, and I mean, penguins with rockets on their backs? really dumb. And you also have to take into account how just plain dark and weird the whole film is...it's TOO dark and weird. It got too Goth for me. Plus, the villains get more attention than Batman does. The action scenes suck. Batman is not very heroic in that film. He seems to be too easily overcome by Penguin and Catwoman, plus he kills people, and is depicted as enjoying it. That's a huge no-no in my book. What else? Christopher Walken is a huge distraction, and an unecessary character to boot. The storyline as a whole is weak and unexciting. The only real saving graces are the music (Elfman is a god), the production design (i love the snowy Gotham sets) and the Batman/Catwoman relationship, that was wr

The third film Batman Forever was a much better film in my book it had more action a better story than Batman Returns had also Batman was heroic in the 3rd film, also the action scenes are much better and like I said the action scenes in Batman Returns sucks. So there is just too many bad things about Batman Returns the story was really weak and it sucks. Anyways I just don't like Batman Returns it had too many flaws.

Batman Returns sucks plain and simple

[shadowbat69]

Jetts not right. In his mind he is right. Its all opinion.  If you think he's right, then thats your opinion.

I think Forevers story is a bit rediculous. Sucking brain waves? C'mon. What was Two Faces point in the movie? Just to have 2 villains? He simply became Riddlers cronie. Two Face was nothing more than some freak out to get Batman, he had no real purpose In Forever.

The action scenes being better had alot to do with the refinement of the batsuit for this film. They were able to make it lighter and make adjustments for more freedom of movement.  The heriocs of Batman in Forever were more grans because they were portraying a different interpretation of Batman than what we had in Batman and Returns.

The story for Returns had alot of deeper psycholgical themes in them than Forever did. It addressed alot of the duality of each character. From Batman/Bruce to Catwoman/Selina and even Penguin/Oswald. Theres alot of inner turmoil and conflict.

The whole too dark or weird thing I just dont get. What was "too dark" about Returns? Penguin was portrayed as a "monster"? Arent all the villains monsters in some way? Was it the plot to kill all of Gothams first born children? To me, that was the most threatening plot of all the movies.

Forever may have been more enoybale for some people because it was meant to be. That was its purpose, to be a summer popcorn movie, and it did that perfectly.

To say that one movie was more "batman" than the other or "more true" than another is just a wasted argument. With so many different interpretations of Batman thru the many years of his history, there is no one defintive Batman. One may prefer a certain characterization over another, but again, its all opinion and personal prefernce. I never say that this movie was better than that movie. I have my personal favorites over the others, but I acknowledge the fact that the other movies are just as valid in their presentation of the characters and their world.


As far as Kane, with each of the 4 movies he says it was his favorite or the actor was the best. He said the same for Clooney. Its all "professional".


Dont take my post the wrong way, Im not arguing with you or saying you are wrong, I am just giving my view, as you did, but I do wonder how much of it was influenced by another persons opinion.

[Gotham Knight]

Jetts not right. In his mind he is right. Its all opinion.  If you think he's right, then thats your opinion.

I think Forevers story is a bit rediculous. Sucking brain waves? C'mon. What was Two Faces point in the movie? Just to have 2 villains? He simply became Riddlers cronie. Two Face was nothing more than some freak out to get Batman, he had no real purpose In Forever.

The action scenes being better had alot to do with the refinement of the batsuit for this film. They were able to make it lighter and make adjustments for more freedom of movement.  The heriocs of Batman in Forever were more grans because they were portraying a different interpretation of Batman than what we had in Batman and Returns.

The story for Returns had alot of deeper psycholgical themes in them than Forever did. It addressed alot of the duality of each character. From Batman/Bruce to Catwoman/Selina and even Penguin/Oswald. Theres alot of inner turmoil and conflict.

The whole too dark or weird thing I just dont get. What was "too dark" about Returns? Penguin was portrayed as a "monster"? Arent all the villains monsters in some way? Was it the plot to kill all of Gothams first born children? To me, that was the most threatening plot of all the movies.

Forever may have been more enoybale for some people because it was meant to be. That was its purpose, to be a summer popcorn movie, and it did that perfectly.

To say that one movie was more "batman" than the other or "more true" than another is just a wasted argument. With so many different interpretations of Batman thru the many years of his history, there is no one defintive Batman. One may prefer a certain characterization over another, but again, its all opinion and personal prefernce. I never say that this movie was better than that movie. I have my personal favorites over the others, but I acknowledge the fact that the other movies are just as valid in their presentation of the characters and their world.


As far as Kane, with each of the 4 movies he says it was his favorite or the actor was the best. He said the same for Clooney. Its all "professional".


Dont take my post the wrong way, Im not arguing with you or saying you are wrong, I am just giving my view, as you did, but I do wonder how much of it was influenced by another persons opinion.

I have to admit I dislike Jett?s website a bit because it seems to be to very heavy on going to the altar of the Nolan films. To me, the BOF site IS a nolanite site. Rather than have each film represented by a party that favors each one so that the Bat films can be ALL appreciated individually (Even the Schumacher ones) and as one epic franchise, it worships the Nolan films as the quintessential Batman movies, and TDK even before its hit theaters, calling TDK the best super hero film ever made.

[Paul (ral)]

and speaking of the penguin, the fact that he's depicted as a deformed freak doesnt work for me at all. the dude actually acts like a penguin, which is really stupid

acting like a penguin?  this is highly accurate.  let me tell you a story. it is a true one that happened in ireland, not far from where i live.  about 50 years ago a boy was born to a young woman out of wed-lock. This was highly frowned upon at the time.  the woman lived with her parents on a farm.  to hide the baby boy, he was kept in a chicken hut with chickens until he was a few years old - when he was found by passers-by one day. The boy was taken into care. He acted like a chicken and had mental issues.  He is still alive and to this day will occasionally display chicken like behaviour.

so if oswald was kept in a circus cage as the "penguin boy" with penguins, i believe he would act like a penguin.

the fact he looks penguin like because he is deformed is a brilliant touch.

[Gotham Knight]

I think Burton added some depth to the Penguin. It also raised the question of choice and how much it is your decision to be who you are. I think that mainstream audiences couldn't handle that. By nature the mainstream viewer can handle a villain who is evil but not evil and repulsive because what it says is sometimes it matters not what decisions you make, people will still hate you based on what you are rather than who you are and that might affect who you become.

[Paul (ral)]

i also like how the penguin was bitter about his identity.  he wants to be called oswald and be seen as human when he is liked by everyone - when he is accepted by gotham, but when gotham turns against him, he turns his back on his real identity and says he is called penguin, that he is an animal.

[Gotham Knight]

ULtamtely a very average villain character was expanded upon masterfully fitting into the themes of Returns. God, if I keep talking like this, I'm going to have to watch it.

[shadowbat69]

Its calling to you.

Watch me.

Watch me.