So-Called Batman Fans Demand Joker's Retirement

[phantom stranger]

I wouldn't be too concerned about their petition.

Besides, I think it's unlikely that Joker would be in the next one regardless. As someone else noted, the third one will probably be Nolan's last. After that, the franchise will go to someone else who may end up going in a totally different direction. And if that person wants the Joker to be in it, he certainly isn't going to be dissuaded from some petition.

[Dark Knight Detective]

I wouldn't be too concerned about their petition.

Besides, I think it's unlikely that Joker would be in the next one regardless. As someone else noted, the third one will probably be Nolan's last. After that, the franchise will go to someone else who may end up going in a totally different direction. And if that person wants the Joker to be in it, he certainly isn't going to be dissuaded from some petition.

The petition doesn't worry me. It's just the amount of people that only worship this Joker in order to cleanse themselves after hearing/reading about Ledger's death. That sickens me.

Like I said earlier, a lot of these so-called "Ledger fans" were skeptical over his casting after they saw him playing a gay cowboy in Brokeback Mountain. But after he died, they loved him for the wrong reasons.

[thecolorsblend]

Like I said earlier, a lot of these so-called "Ledger fans" were skeptical over his casting after they saw him playing a gay cowboy in Brokeback Mountain. But after he died, they loved him for the wrong reasons.

I guess you and I just have fundamentally different memories of all that.  I remember the Ledger hysteria starting up when the teaser came out.  At that point, all we had to go on was Ledger's dialogue from the teaser and a few fuzzy images of him.  The hysteria really went into overdrive after he passed away but even before then everybody was going on and on about how awesome he was.

That being said, as I recall I was as taken aback by his casting as anybody.  He's always going to be Patrick Verona from 10 Things I Hate About You to me but esp at the time I thought he had the wrong facial features for the Joker, even if he might've otherwise been able to do the role justice.  And strictly speaking, that's an opinion I stand by.  Otherwise, he of course kicked @$$ with the role.

[Batmoney]

Although I thought it was an odd choice, I never really doubted Ledger's selection because after Batman Begins it seemed obvious to me that Nolan had a good grasp on what he was doing and what he wanted to do with the characters. On top of that, unlike many of these new age fans, I actually knew who Ledger was and knew of his films. Not a huge fan of his or anything, but I knew he was a capable actor and that he had been in award winning films before.

I guess that is what really boils me about this whole thing, is that I'm not even a fan-boy or Heath-crazy, but yet I still know and understand this situation for what it is. I'm sure Heath would be very honored that they want to retire this character on his behalf, but if you really know the kind of guy he was known for being, this is the last thing he would want. As a matter of fact, he would have probably been spinning in his grave already over the 'TDK owns all' and Heath's Joker being the be all end all of comic book villainy.

It seems to me that none of these people who are trying to immortalize Heath are actually taking what he would have wanted into consideration. They are just so blinded by their lust for a hero, or icon, that they will do anything to make it final and absolute, even though it already is.

I think Heath Ledger was a good actor, who's best years were still ahead of him, and I think he did give the performance of a lifetime. Aside from that, I don't think he would want anything to do with these schmucks who are trying to make him bigger than the role he played, or the schmucks who have caused the erruption of all these truly moronic debates about the franchise and its films.

[Batman]

Oh my god! So far they have over 23,000 signatures!

Maybe they rigged the petition? I wouldn't put it past those nuts to use fake identities.
Anyway, they probably wouldn't have gotten half as many signatures if CNN hadn't given them media exposure.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/heathultimatejoker/sets/72157613451322381/

[Sandman]

Oh my god! So far they have over 23,000 signatures!

http://www.theultimatejoker.com/

You don't think this will actully go through, Do you?

And it raises another question, If Nolan love's Batman as much as much as it's made out he does, Then the last thing he should want is The Joker's Retirement (even if he doesn't want him in his series again).

[batass4880]

Oh my god! So far they have over 23,000 signatures!

http://www.theultimatejoker.com/

You don't think this will actully go through, Do you?

No I don't. I was just pointing out that there are now apparently over 30,000 self-proclaimed dummies who are trying to get something really stupid and unattainable to get done.

[Cocoboloboy]

Ledger was a great Joker for Nolan's style of Batman. Nicholson was great for Burton's and somebody else will be great for another directors vision on down the road.

Personally I haven't seen the "ultimate" on screen Joker yet. Maybe if you took the best of both movie Jokers so far and combined them then we'd be close. 

[Batnar]

Okae.. this is just my opinion. And I'm not trying to start any flame wars. This is specifically my complete honest and as non bias opinion about the Nolan films as possible...

I honestly, HONESTLY, thought that Heath Ledger came in a bit short as the Joker and with not nearly enough screen time nor character development nor variation.

He was just acting like a sick demented patient which is 1 cool point for him, but that's all there was. And I'm sorry.. But I've seen many people on youtube in their Ledger costume act like Ledger without too much trouble, however, I've yet to ever see someone do a good Jack Nicholson Joker impersonation and try and come close. The variations are too erratic and masterfully handled in a very natural way by JN.

Watching Ledger was like a very short roller coaster ride that I waited hours in line for and I'm too focused to fall into the unguided frenzy of the hype a lot of young (or new) bat fans, created. NOT satisfied what so ever. And that killed me inside because I really was aching to see a Joker that would either out do  or match the acting magnificence of Jack Nicholson (in their own respective styles).

Plus, come on... Jack friggin' Nicholson. Yeah he's old now. But look at his career time line people. That man made nothing but literally "bad ass" movies. He was known for being this intimidating actor even in real life. He's won so many awards and rightfully deserved too. He's a friggin' legend and today's youth are completely ignoring it just to serve their bs internet war against the bat fans who didn't care for DK Joker. Aka that stupid petition.

I pray some of these new kids would go and research before completely and blindly eliminating the obvious greatness that Jack gave us in 1989 that for those many years, NO ONE would dare even bother to fill his shoes. I mean he was that great that actors nor directors would even bother. That's crazy.
And undeniable even by today's standards which hahahah, have actually lowered dramatically to make room for all the BOOMS! AND AAAHHHS SFX.

Heath.. I'm sorry. Yeah he's dead. But so is my grandpa. Life goes on.
That contributes nothing to his acting role in the film. So why embed that factor with exaggeration when watching it?

Or make silly sites with petitions to lock away a Joker character. LMAO... I mean really... Do you HONESTLY think that they are going to permanently square out the Joker character in a future Bat film under a different direct 10 years from now?
Sorry kiddies...lol, Not gonnuH' happin'! Impossible.
The Joker is a staple villain. Of  COURSE we're going to see more Jokers. Maybe 2 more in our time line. Or 3. Who knows what would happen in between the gaps of every decade.

I kid you not... I actually fell asleep for 10 minutes through this movie.  So many things happening at once. 2 to 3 Villains. Bruce is out of focus. Everything is sporadic and you can smell Nolan's realism fart through all of it which just confused me half the times.. Some parts were outrageous, yet other parts were too darn real and ho hum. They weren't mixed into each other as one nice smoothie.

I hated the new bat suit (i never cared for the Begins either) the masks are just not as good as they could have been.

I loved the idea of Chris playing Batman but I was saddened to see he wasn't really able to captivate my interest as Bruce. He was a one tone character. A ho-hum throughout the film.
Again, NO variation. When he was Bruce. I remember I laughed when he was caught sleeping in that one scene in his building. But I laughed because in my head, I agreed, yeah...this is boring.

But see... this is only because I didn't follow the hype. If I did. I would have came out screaming "THE BEST BAT FILM EVER!" But I remained focus and non bias.
Well...technically.. Nolan is very fortunate that the previous 2 bat films sucked balls because anything is better than those two. lol.
So yeah, I respect the 2 new bat films. I "like" them. But they hardly reached home base. I don't even remember how the details of Bat's new suit looks like.  In other words, I don't find anything aside from the bat logo, to be iconic.


Im sorry I trashed it like this. Im really a nice guy about things like this, but I just can't see what all the hype is about. He wasn't that great! I CAN act like Heath Ledger Joker easily. I think anyone can. Just be crazy weird and add some homicide in there and you ARE SET!

But try giving me variation. Something!

See in my head.. I must be soo far advanced because I expected a whole lot more. Not a Jack Joker duplicate by any means, but something MORE.
Everything in that movie was sooo predictable. And I can smell that it was made for an age group and not for a timeless piece.

I guess, we'll see the concensus 15 years from now. I bet the new fans of tomorrow will crap all over Heath just the way the young fans today are crapping all over Jack. (blindly)
Just stretching the quality more and more into a thin waste of time.

thanks for reading.

[DocLathropBrown]

Completely agreed. I'm an actor (nothing professional, though), and I can do Ledger's Joker dead-on, no problem.

I still cannot capture Nicholson's performance unless I'm deliberately copying his exact performance from a scene in the film. Trying to imitate it and adapt it? I can't do it. I can even do the Romero and Hamill Jokers no problem.

Granted, a lot of it is in how well you can do a Jack Nicholson impression, but that is so much a part of it. There's just too much going on in Nicholson's mind, in his existance. I can't even begin to do justice to Nicholson himself, let alone his performance as the Joker.

Ledger is by no means a poor actor, but he wasn't up to Jack's abilities, though he easily could have been some day. But his version of the Joker was really nothing special. Fun to watch? You bet your ass. Deep and inimitatible? Not a chance.