Superman-III & IV

[Dark Knight Detective]

Colorsblend, nothing, & I mean absolutely NOTHING, beats Chris Reeve's flying scenes.

[thecolorsblend]

Colorsblend, nothing, & I mean absolutely NOTHING, beats Chris Reeve's flying scenes. He immersed into the roles of Clark Kent & the Superman. Here's my say on the best actors to play the World's Finest: Christopher Reeve is to Superman as Michael Keaton is to Batman.

Are you referring to my "Supergirl's flying is better than Reeve's" bit?  If you are, be advised that I'm talking about the quality of the effects themselves.  There are several money shots of Supergirl flying around, doing her thing, etc.  The scope and quality of those scenes far exceeds anything we saw in the Reeve films (except MAYBE Superman III).  It's not a knock on Reeve or the technicians behind those effects, it's just a statement of the facts.

[Dark Knight Detective]

My mistake. What I meant to say was that no matter how better the quality was in the Supergirl flying scenes, Reeve owns.

[Sandman]

Love or hate Superman 3, you have to love the SM vs CK fight.

[The Dark Knight]

Love or hate Superman 3, you have to love the SM vs CK fight.

Meh. I didn't. It's nothing special IMO.

[thecolorsblend]

Nothing special?  In terms of choreography or "wow" factor, no, it's not but what it represents for the character... you can't underestimate that.

That's enough from me for now, I'm off to get some steak and baked potato soup from Outback.  That stuff is more addictive than something that's really addictive!

[Dark Knight Detective]

Nothing special?  In terms of choreography or "wow" factor, no, it's not but what it represents for the character... you can't underestimate that.

Agreed, even though it's a sad shame that the rest of the film couldn't carry itself in a manner such as this.

[Sandman]

Nothing special?  In terms of choreography or "wow" factor, no, it's not but what it represents for the character... you can't underestimate that.

True none of the Superman movies have action scenes to rave about, but then again thats no what they where meant to be. I just meant i love how it shows that struggle between Superman's Good and Evil side, and that they disliked each other so much that they actually fight, with Superman's true side winning.

[thecolorsblend]

I've really changed my opinion on Superman III over the years. I think it's primarily because I wasn't willing to contextualize it. Ilya Salkind said in his commentary that it's meant to be "a Superman episode". "The Superman saga" could be understood as STM and S2. But S3 is what he does the rest of the time.

The other thing was my burgeoning love for the Bronze Age Superman. Back then, it was pretty common for a guest star to come along, take center stage and then vanish, never to be seen or heard from again.

There is humor in Superman III but it's unfair as hell to say any of it is directed at Superman. The jokes are in the movie but they're not about the movie or the character. And that means something.

On top of all that, most people think S3 is completely separated from STM and S2 so far as continuity. I'm not so convinced. Basically, in the first two see Superman win and then lose Lois. You think that was an easy decision for him to make? To me, it seems logical that he'd want to go to Smallville, see the old gang, reaffirm old loyalties and try to forget some of what he'd just been through. And while he's there, it makes sense he'd run in to Lana. And it makes sense that he'd find some amount of comfort in her presence.

When he gets exposed to that messed up Kryptonite... frankly, his reaction shouldn't have been a surprise. His internal struggles and pain become externalized as rage, hostility and selfishness against his will. Anybody who's been through a nasty breakup can maybe relate to this in ways they're entirely comfortable with. I'm sure not. Superman repressed this stuff because that's what Superman does... but that doesn't mean those feelings aren't there beneath the surface. All the Kryptonite did was bring the anguish and misery to the surface in a way he had specifically chosen to not allow to happen.

Is there too much Richard Pryor? That's a matter of taste. I find his scenes a lot more palatable than some people seem to.

The music is something else. Ken Thorne doesn't get the credit he should for taking a lot of Williams themes to the next level in the scores he made. He took a Williams Krypton theme and turned it into a dark, villainous piece of music (the criminals in S2 and the poisoned Superman in S3). He luxuriated in the main hero theme, particularly in the S2 opening credits. Go back and listen to it sometime, it's like he couldn't get enough of it.

Is Superman III the greatest Superman film ever? Maybe not. But it's a damn sight better than it gets credit for.

[riddler]

I've really changed my opinion on Superman III over the years. I think it's primarily because I wasn't willing to contextualize it. Ilya Salkind said in his commentary that it's meant to be "a Superman episode". "The Superman saga" could be understood as STM and S2. But S3 is what he does the rest of the time.

The other thing was my burgeoning love for the Bronze Age Superman. Back then, it was pretty common for a guest star to come along, take center stage and then vanish, never to be seen or heard from again.

There is humor in Superman III but it's unfair as hell to say any of it is directed at Superman. The jokes are in the movie but they're not about the movie or the character. And that means something.

On top of all that, most people think S3 is completely separated from STM and S2 so far as continuity. I'm not so convinced. Basically, in the first two see Superman win and then lose Lois. You think that was an easy decision for him to make? To me, it seems logical that he'd want to go to Smallville, see the old gang, reaffirm old loyalties and try to forget some of what he'd just been through. And while he's there, it makes sense he'd run in to Lana. And it makes sense that he'd find some amount of comfort in her presence.

When he gets exposed to that messed up Kryptonite... frankly, his reaction shouldn't have been a surprise. His internal struggles and pain become externalized as rage, hostility and selfishness against his will. Anybody who's been through a nasty breakup can maybe relate to this in ways they're entirely comfortable with. I'm sure not. Superman repressed this stuff because that's what Superman does... but that doesn't mean those feelings aren't there beneath the surface. All the Kryptonite did was bring the anguish and misery to the surface in a way he had specifically chosen to not allow to happen.

Is there too much Richard Pryor? That's a matter of taste. I find his scenes a lot more palatable than some people seem to.

The music is something else. Ken Thorne doesn't get the credit he should for taking a lot of Williams themes to the next level in the scores he made. He took a Williams Krypton theme and turned it into a dark, villainous piece of music (the criminals in S2 and the poisoned Superman in S3). He luxuriated in the main hero theme, particularly in the S2 opening credits. Go back and listen to it sometime, it's like he couldn't get enough of it.

Is Superman III the greatest Superman film ever? Maybe not. But it's a damn sight better than it gets credit for.

It goes without saying that some bat fans are attached to a director; nolanites, non-nolanites, or burtonites. The superman films aren't quite to this extent but there's plenty which are Donnerites if you will; only accept his version. I think superman 3 is one of those films which may have picked up over time. A lot of film franchises go south by the 3rd or 4th installment essentially spoofing themselves with poor attempt at comedy. The difference is instead of this film taking itself seriously and attempting to simutaneously be funny, it actually sets out to be comedic and doesn't hide it bringing in Richard Pryor. And unlike the ultra dark bruce wayne, Clark Kent does set out to be bumbling and nerdy so the comedy kind of works as it is natural with the character and thus not forced. Also like you said it doesn't make fun of supes himself.

I also like how it finally goes without Lex Luthor. Lex is a great villain but 4 films out of 5 is kind of excessive. Robert Vaughn is also excellent and actually could have played Luthor if they could have given him the right look. The dark superman was well executed. It should also be noted that this film did not flop as some indicated. It did decently at the box office considering it went up against Return of the jedi.