Jaws

[Silver Nemesis]

This thread is for discussion about Steven Spielberg's 1975 movie Jaws and its three sequels, but it can also be used to discuss any spinoffs or rip-offs related to the Jaws franchise.

I've mentioned before in other threads that I'm a sucker for speculative fiction with an oceanic theme. Any sci-fi, fantasy or horror story that's set by the sea, on the sea or under the sea is my kind of thing. So Jaws resonates with me big time. Duel (1971) and Jaws are Spielberg's two most Hitchcockian films, and the latter always reminds me of The Birds (1963). They're both suspense thrillers about coastal communities being terrorised by a force of nature. Only Jaws is a better film IMO, and I say that despite Hitchcock being my favourite director. Spielberg's idea of using John Williams' music to indicate the shark's presence, and thus circumvent the technical limitations of the mechanical shark itself, was a stroke of genius. It allowed Jaws to transcend being just another generic monster flick and to hook the audience's interest with suspense and drama rather than a reliance on special effects. It's a B movie concept executed with A movie skill.

The first half of the film functions like a horror or disaster movie, with the emphasis on the townsfolk gradually coming to grips with the unseen killer that's stalking them. The second half plays out more like an adventure thriller, with the three male leads setting sail to do battle with the shark in its own environment. If you class the storyline in terms of the seven basic archetypal narratives, Jaws is very much the Beowulf or 'Overcoming the Monster' plot: a community is terrorised by a monster, a hero is brought in to deal with it, the hero must learn more about the beast and then hunt it down in its own territory before ultimately slaying it in one-on-one combat.

I favour the second half of the movie over the first, mainly because I like the dynamic between Brody, Quint and Hooper as the latter two vie for alpha male status before eventually bonding over their scars. Ultimately it's Brody himself who emerges as the alpha male hero, and the image of him battling the shark with a harpoon and a rifle slung over his shoulder as he clings to the wreckage of the sinking Orca is one of the manliest images in cinematic history.

That has to be the second greatest man versus shark scene ever filmed. I think we all know what the greatest is.

The performances are strong all round, and especially those of Roy Scheider and Robert Shaw. There's also some terrific dialogue in the script. My favourite scene in the whole movie is Quint's chilling monologue about the fate of the USS Indianapolis.

I've always thought it would've been amusing if when the shark explodes, and we see its body parts sinking to the bottom of the sea, we also saw Quint's semi-digested corpse floating among them. Or at least his severed arm bearing the Indianapolis tattoo. But the first Jaws film is too classy to do something like that. It might have made a funny twist at the end of Jaws: The Revenge though – if the shark blew up and Quint's arm was expelled from its stomach, revealing that it was actually the same shark in all four movies. Of course then you'd have to explain why Quint's arm had failed to digest, or how the shark regenerated itself three times.

To my mind, the original Jaws is one of those rare 10 out of 10 films. In terms of where I'd rank it among my favourite Spielberg movies, I'd place it just below the classic Indiana Jones trilogy and just above Poltergeist, Duel and Close Encounters. It's a truly great film that helped launch the trend of the summer blockbuster movie. I'll post my thoughts on the sequels at a later time, but for now I'd like to argue a point that some may find controversial. However, it's a perspective I feel compelled to express.

The mayor in Jaws did nothing wrong.

There's a trope in the disaster movie genre of the obstinate authority figure who refuses to heed early warnings and ends up with blood on his hands. Admittedly Mayor Larry Vaughn is the closest thing the original Jaws has to that cliché, but his villainous reputation is ill earned. He was struggling to keep the economy going during the most crucial time of year for Amity's tourist trade. He was under pressure from the town council and local business owners to safeguard the revenue stream the community relied on from its summertime visitors: "Look, we depend on the summer people here for our very lives." Now Brody comes along making the improbable claim that a freak shark attack has occurred. The local coroner contradicts this by stating it was a "probable boating accident". Larry very reasonably decides to keep the beaches open. Based on the information he had at the time, there was no reason to close them and risk jeopardising the tourist trade.

Then the second death occurs and we learn there really is a shark. Larry clearly isn't happy about this. He didn't want some kid to get eaten. It's bad for tourism and will haunt him come election time. He makes the sensible decision to temporarily close the beaches until the shark is caught. But then fishermen catch a tiger shark, which oceanographer Matt Hooper himself admits is "probably" the shark they're looking for: "Now I'm not saying that this is not the shark. It probably is, Martin. It probably is." Again, based on the information available to him at the time the mayor was perfectly justified in reopening the beaches.

Hooper then claims to have found the tooth of a great white shark, but conveniently misplaces it. He and Brody also neglect to provide evidence of Ben Gardner's death when they discuss the matter with Larry (probably because the scene with the head popping out of the wrecked boat was added during reshoots). What was Larry supposed to do? Go to the town hall and announce he's shutting down the economy without any evidence to justify the shark's existence, all on the testimony of two men who were clearly wasted when they saw the alleged proof?

Ok, now in hindsight we can clearly see that Brody and Hooper were right about the existence of the great white shark. But based on the lack of evidence presented to him, how was Larry to know that? What was the alternative course of action? To shut down the beaches, discourage tourism and bankrupt any number of local businesses, all because of a one in a million chance there might be a giant shark on the loose? When he's presented with concrete evidence of the monster's existence, he takes the appropriate action and hires Quint to kill it. That decision ultimately results in the shark's destruction. We can thank Larry for that. Moreover, Jaws 2 takes place four years after the first film, and guess who's still mayor of Amity?

That means the people of Amity re-elected him. So he was obviously doing something right. I'd also point out a deleted scene from Jaws 2 in which the town council deliberates on whether to fire Brody as chief of police. Larry is the only one who stands up for Brody.

In another deleted scene he votes not to fire him. He eventually goes along with the decision, but only because all the other council members outvoted him and he had no hope of changing their minds. But the fact remains he was against firing Brody and tried to prevent it from happening. Meanwhile Larry's son, Larry Jr., helped rescue and protect Brody's youngest son Sean after his big brother Michael endangered him by taking him sailing during shark season.

On top of all this, Mayor Vaughn was a nice guy. He tries to comfort Brody after Mrs. Kintner publically blames him for her son's death: "I'm sorry, Martin. She's wrong." Later he goes to the hospital with Brody and his family after their son Michael is admitted with shock, and we see how distraught he is by what's happened. In Jaws 2 he takes a moment to say some words of encouragement to Michael during his first day working on the beach. Larry Vaughn was a good mayor, a loving father and a man of conscience. I'd argue this is a Johnny Lawrence situation where it's time to stop hating the so-called villain, try seeing things from his perspective and start appreciating all the good he did. Which in this case includes saving the islanders from the shark by sending Quint, Hooper and Brody to kill it, hanging up "little paint-happy bastards" by their buster browns, and maintaining a healthy economy by safeguarding the local tourist industry.

His ridiculous jackets, however, are indefensible.

So what does everyone else think about Jaws? And what do you think about the sequels? Post your own observations and reviews here.

[thecolorsblend]

If you ask me, Jaws is quintessential Spielberg. Nothing against anything else Spielberg ever did, honestly. I'm sort of a fan of his work.

But Spielberg was locked into SOMETHING when it comes to Jaws. And nothing else he ever directed (up to and including Jurassic Park) can quite reach the magic of Jaws. Spielberg was lean and hungry when he made the movie and he definitely had something to prove. If you ask me, he proved it a thousand times over.

People make a lot of hay out of the Indianapolis speech or the Kintner attack. I've even seen people point to the pier sequence with the holiday roast as the movie's high point.

But if you ask me, NOTHING competes with Hooper and Brody tooling around on the boat looking for the shark and accidentally tumbling onto the wreckage of Ben Gardner's boat.

The music, the light, the haze/fog/smoke/whatever, the atmosphere, the backstories for Hooper and Brody both, there's some serious power to that scene. And what you realize as you watch it is you're worried about the shark, even tho he's nowhere to be seen, even tho there's no way he could damage a boat as sturdy and sophisticated as Hooper's. You're still antsy about it the whole time, esp when Hooper takes a dive.

It's a master class of economical filmmaking. I've never been able to get a straight answer if this entire sequence was added in later or if only the underwater stuff with Hooper was added in later during pickup shooting. Either way, this moment is probably my favorite in the entire film. It's brief but it says everything you need to know about the movie. I just cherish it.

As far as Vaughn is concerned, I'll go a step further and say he objectively did the right thing by keeping the beaches open for as long as he did. Because in a sense, he's only a figurehead. Clearly, the town council could remove him if he didn't play the game their way. His job was basically to be a frontman for Amity, a cheerleader encouraging tourists to pay them a visit (and spend money!) rather than an actual leader with actual authority. He did his job well too. He played the part of the friendly mayor to perfection because he probably never expected to face an ACTUAL crisis in his entire political career.

So, let's play this out. Suppose he HAD shut down the beaches just like Brody recommended. And while we're at it, let's also suppose that he somehow survived the town council's inevitable recall effort.

Guess what? Shutting down the beaches WOULD HAVE WORKED and the shark would've quietly moved someplace else. Believe it or not, that's actually a bad thing.

Islanders would've (understandably) been upset about missing an entire summer, the town's economy would've taken a massive hit, businesses would've collapsed and there would've been plenty of misery to go around.

And in the end, NOTHING WOULD HAVE HAPPENED.

The islanders would always be able to say (with some credence) that Vaughn shut the beaches down "and it was all for nothing". Because there would've been no confirmed shark attacks, no real proof that anything was ever amiss and it would've LOOKED to the islanders like Vaughn panicked at the first RUMOR of trouble and then he jumped the gun, harming everyone in the process.

If the above had happened, Vaughn would've been forced to resign in disgrace or else face getting voted out by an irate island of unemployed voters who would've wanted his blood.

But after the third shark attack (the one involving Sean), not only did he have good reason to close the beaches, but now he had an obvious mandate to throw some public funds into Mrs. Kintner's bounty so that Quint could go looking for the shark.

Best of all? At the risk of being morbid, Quint died in the hunt. So, Mrs. Kintner AND the town were able to hang on to their money. The contracts were with Quint, remember. Brody was just doing his job as chief of police and it's not like Hooper ever needed (or wanted) the money anyway. So, with Quint out of the picture, nobody has to smash open their piggy bank. So, from the islanders' point of view, not only did Vaughn do the right thing by keeping the beaches open for a while, but he took the shark out of commission AND saved the island a bundle of money in the process. Best of all, they probably WERE able to save August.

Not joking, I can totally see how he got reelected after all that. It rly does make sense.

I've seen the sequels. But it's been years. Frankly, I don't care about them. For me, there's only the original film. The sequels, eh, I'll skip them, thx.

[The Joker]

To my mind, the original Jaws is one of those rare 10 out of 10 films.

Oh, no doubt!

A classic film, that's sincerely in a class all of it's own. Honestly, "JAWS" is my favorite Spielberg film ever. It's just perfect.

As far as the Mayor Larry Vaughn topic of discussion goes, the original "JAWS" does lean into the notion that Mayor Vaughn is only concerned about the 'summer dollars', but it's only on a cursory sort of level. As the film gives the Mayor several outs indicating to the audience/viewer that he's not this simple evil mustache twirling politician, but a actual person who not only shows empathy for the horrors that transpired on the beaches of Amity that summer, but also for Chief Martin Brody as well during a very tense interaction with a grieving mother. Again, this is not presented in a overstated fashion, but it truly didn't need to be, and the movie is better for it. "JAWS 2" also signifies this compassionate trait in Mayor Vaughn's character, but it's once again not magnified upon in the final film. Which is fitting.

Speaking of Amity Island Mayors, I believe the "JAWS Unleashed" video game either stated or implied that Larry Vaughn's son was the Mayor of Amity Island during the events of that game. Which was a cool nod, and gives further credence that the Vaughn name still carried weight politically on Amity years following Larry's final term.

Silver bringing up the idea of the shark "regenerating" is funny, but this allows me to bring up a small tidbit I read in "JAWS Unmade: The Lost Sequels, Prequels, Remakes and Rip-Offs" book, where Universal were actually considering, or at least proposing, the idea of bringing the scarred shark from JAWS 2 back for another go. It's been awhile since I've read that book, and right now I can't remember if this idea was suggested for "JAWS 3" or "JAWS The Revenge", but I literally had to do a double take and re-read that again when I initially saw that. Sure, the sequels (especially) lean into the inexplicable, but you may as just as well go with Richard Zanuck and David Brown's original idea for a 3rd film (JAWS 3, People 0) if you're actually considering that.

[Silver Nemesis]

The original Jaws is getting an IMAX rerelease starting today, and I'm hoping to catch a screening over the next week or so. In anticipation of that, I bought a DVD set containing Jaws 2, 3 and 4 and watched them all over the past few nights. I already have the original film on DVD and I watch it every summer, but I haven't seen the sequels from start to finish since I was a child. Revisiting them as an adult was... interesting.

The three sequels all essentially ignore one another and follow on directly from Spielberg's original. They all focus on the adult Michael Brody as the main protagonist, and none of them bother to explain why another giant shark just happens to show up wherever the Brody family is. The original shark was presented as a freak of nature in Spielberg's film, but according to the sequels it's merely one of many such giant sharks.

Here are some observations on each sequel.

Jaws 2 (1978)

I would place Jaws 2 in the same boat (pun intended) as Psycho II (1983) and Poltergeist II (1986). All three films are unnecessary sequels to classic films made by revered directors, and all three are often dismissed out of hand for that very reason. But all three, if you give them a chance, are not that bad. They're certainly nowhere near as great as the classic films they're following, but when judged on their own merits they're decent sequels.

Jaws 2 had the same producers as the original film, and many of the cast members returned along with John Williams as composer. This lends it a feeling of continuity with Spielberg's movie that the other sequels lack. I've heard that Scheider really didn't want to make another Jaws film, but was contractually obligated to. To his credit, he gives a solid performance and doesn't let his lack of enthusiasm shine through on screen.

The biggest problems with the film are the rather dull scenes with the teenage characters, and just the overall sense of déjà vu. We've seen this all before. Jaws 2 doesn't really add anything substantial to the first film. It's a competent retread that should satisfy people hungry for more of the same, but beyond that it has little else to offer. But it's not bad.

Jaws 3 (1983)

Jaws 3 is bad. The central idea of a giant shark finding its way into SeaWorld had potential, and there are one or two moments I like. For example, the bit where the characters realise the shark they captured is only a baby, and then the huge oversized mother shark appears behind the underwater window. But on balance, this is not a good film. Many of the shots are blurry on the DVD I watched, which I assume has something to do with the method used to film it in 3D rather than incompetence on the part of the focus puller. Either way, the photography doesn't look good.

The special effects are astonishingly bad, with obvious matte lines and lifeless animatronics rendering many of the shark sequences unintentionally hilarious. These are easily the worst effects of any entry in the series.

The human characters are uninteresting, which makes it hard to care about anything that's happening. That surprised me, considering Richard Matheson is credited for the screenplay. But apparently Matheson himself was critical of the script doctoring that went on, so I don't think he's to blame. He was a fine writer, and Jaws 3, in its finished state, is unworthy of his name. Alan Parker's score is also grossly inferior to Williams' iconic work on the previous two films. The whole idea of a shark movie set in an enclosed aquatic environment was done better in Renny Harlin's Deep Blue Sea (1999). I don't think DBS is a particularly great film either, but it's better than Jaws 3.

To sum up, Jaws 3 – or Jaws 3D, to use its original title – has a couple of amusing scenes and an interesting setting, but the writing, photography and special effects are all subpar.

Jaws: The Revenge (1987)

Jaws 3 had an interesting setup but weak character drama that made it hard to care about what was happening. Jaws 4 has kind of the opposite problem: it focuses all of its attention on character development, which isn't terribly well handled, and neglects to craft a compelling or suspenseful storyline. Consequently there's no dramatic impetus driving things. No sense of urgency, such as the original film had. The narrative just meanders while the characters stare into the distance for long repetitive spells. The filmmakers were clearly trying to take a more psychological approach to the subject matter, but the script, directing, and editing aren't deft enough to make it work. On the positive side, Lorraine Gary delivers a strong performance as Ellen Brody. Her acting really belongs in a better film.

If Jaws 4 has a redeeming quality it's that the finale is hilarious. First there's the laugh-out-loud moment where the shark eats the plane. Michael Caine's reaction to seeing the shark is pure gold.

A minute later, Caine's character suddenly resurfaces and climbs aboard the boat, only now his clothes are completely dry. Then we have the shark repeatedly poking its head above the water and roaring like a lion. Ellen experiences flashbacks to earlier events that she wasn't present to witness, including her late husband saying "Smile, you son of a bitch!" Mario Van Peebles' character gets eaten by the shark, all shot and edited in overwrought slow mo. And finally we have the shark spontaneously exploding when Ellen rams it with the boat, all because... it swallowed an explosive earlier on? So the bowsprit just happened to puncture this 30-foot long shark at the precise spot where the explosive was resting inside it?

Honestly, the ending is so bad it's awesome. Here's what Sir Michael Caine had to say about Jaws 4:

"Somebody said, 'Have you ever seen Jaws 4?' I said, 'No. But I've seen the house it bought for my mum. It's fantastic!'"

To conclude, Jaws is a timeless masterpiece. Jaws 2 is an inferior and unnecessary sequel, but not too bad when judged as a standalone film. Jaws 3 and 4 are bloody awful.

But if you ask me, NOTHING competes with Hooper and Brodie tooling around on the boat looking for the shark and accidentally tumbling onto the wreckage of Ben Gardner's boat.

The music, the light, the haze/fog/smoke/whatever, the atmosphere, the backstories for Hooper and Brodie both, there's some serious power to that scene. And what you realize as you watch it is you're worried about the shark, even tho he's nowhere to be seen, even tho there's no way he could damage a boat as sturdy and sophisticated as Hooper's. You're still antsy about it the whole time, esp when Hooper takes a dive.

It's a master class of economical filmmaking. I've never been able to get a straight answer if this entire sequence was added in later or if only the underwater stuff with Hooper was added in later during pickup shooting. Either way, this moment is probably my favorite in the entire film. It's brief but it says everything you need to know about the movie. I just cherish it.

That is a great scene. I've never really thought of Jaws as a horror movie, but if it is to be categorised as such then that particular scene offers the strongest justification.

If the above had happened, Vaughn would've been forced to resign in disgrace or else face getting voted out by an irate island of unemployed voters who would've wanted his blood.

True. We see how easily the powers that be eighty-six Brody in the second movie. With enough pressure from local businessmen, I'm certain Vaughn would have got the same treatment.

Best of all? At the risk of being morbid, Quint died in the hunt. So, Mrs. Kintner AND the town were able to hang on to their money. The contracts were with Quint, remember. Brodie was just doing his job as chief of police and it's not like Hooper ever needed (or wanted) the money anyway. So, with Quint out of the picture, nobody has to smash open their piggy bank. So, from the islanders' point of view, not only did Vaughn do the right thing by keeping the beaches open for a while, but he took the shark out of commission AND saved the island a bundle of money in the process. Best of all, they probably WERE able to save August.

I hadn't even considered this, but it's a good point. A contractor eaten is a dollar saved.

Speaking of Amity Island Mayors, I believe the "JAWS Unleashed" video game either stated or implied that Larry Vaughn's son was the Mayor of Amity Island during the events of that game.

Was he? Ha! Larry Jr. comes off a bit surly in the early scenes of Jaws 2, but in the end he proved more heroic than Michael Brody. He took charge of the situation when the teens were in trouble and he looked out for Sean. I'm glad he became mayor.

Silver bringing up the idea of the shark "regenerating" is funny, but this allows me to bring up a small tidbit I read in "JAWS Unmade: The Lost Sequels, Prequels, Remakes and Rip-Offs" book, where Universal were actually considering, or at least proposing, the idea of bringing the scarred shark from JAWS 2 back for another go. It's been awhile since I've read that book, and right now I can't remember if this idea was suggested for "JAWS 3" or "JAWS The Revenge", but I literally had to do a double take and re-read that again when I initially saw that. Sure, the sequels (especially) lean into the inexplicable, but you may as just as well go with Richard Zanuck and David Brown's original idea for a 3rd film (JAWS 3, People 0) if you're actually considering that.

On one of the Jaws 2 DVD features the producers credit Spielberg with vetoing Jaws 3, People 0. I wonder if his aversion to the idea was influenced by the critical failure of his own comedy 1941 (1979). On the one hand, it seems like common sense not to resort to self parody that early in the series. But on the other hand, after seeing how bad the third and fourth movies were, could a spoof have been any worse? Perhaps they should have taken the comedy route for Jaws V. Then the franchise could have continued all the way to Jaws 19 (2015).

[thecolorsblend]

Classifying the genre of Jaws is no easy task.

The horror/monster movie elements are self-evident. I don't think I need to explore that too much.

There's also "police procedural masquerading as a creature feature". How does Brody attempt to crack this particular nut? He begins by creating a profile of the "perp". He studies encyclopedias, shark books and so forth. He's a cop first and foremost. And since it's not like the shark has a rap sheet he can consult, Brody has no choice but to resort to books and academic texts to get a portrait of the "suspect". This is useful information for him. But it doesn't bring him to the truth that he's looking for.

Incidentally, when people say that Jaws is (or could be) a spiritual sequel to The French Connection, I think the above is what they have in mind. Sure, the character's name is "Brody", they argue. Because it can't legally be Cloudy Russo. But what we know of Brody's backstory is largely compatible with Cloudy Russo. And where Russo failed in The French Connection, Brody succeeds in Jaws. It's interesting to think about, if nothing else.

Some people have even argued that Jaws is a lite political thriller, casting Vaughn as the TRUE villain, an avatar for the corruption, incompetence and apathy of The System (i.e., the American government post-Vietnam, post-Watergate, etc.). And let's be realistic, that's not exactly verboten territory for Hollywood films of the Seventies. Still, I don't think this interpretation holds any truck in this thread. It certainly doesn't with me. But it's worth mentioning.

But another possible genre is straight forward Man Vs. Nature action-adventure. Which is more defensible than I first thought, honestly. The swashbuckling theme...

... heard at 04:51 here...

... and 00:43 here easily lends itself to the action-adventure genre.

The reality is that Jaws hits upon a few different genres. Which one is most prominent is most likely in the eye of the beholder. I've always considered Jaws to be a horror/monster movie. But I am willing to admit that's not the only way of looking at the issue.

[Silver Nemesis]

This is my first time hearing that theory about Cloudy being Brody. Now I'm wondering what it would've been like if Popeye Doyle had gone to Amity Island instead of Marseille. I imagine Doyle and Quint would've ended up either killing each other or becoming best drinking buddies.

With the genre question, I would again compare Jaws to Alfred Hitchcock's The Birds. Wikipedia defines The Birds as "a 1963 American natural horror-thriller film". That's quite a mouthful. I'd argue The Birds is definitely a horror movie. The first half of the film is more of a psychological drama examining the disruptive impact that Tippi Hedren's character has on the insulated community of Bodega Bay. The second half focuses more on terror and suspenseful set pieces, with plenty of shocks and gory images intended to unsettle the viewer.

Like most Hitchcock films, it can fall under the broad banner of 'suspense thriller'. But The Birds is different from suspense thrillers like, say, Strangers on a Train. It's the horror aspect that distinguishes it, just as it distinguishes Psycho from North by Northwest. Sure, they're all suspense thrillers, but Psycho and The Birds also have that horror touch that's lacking from many of Hitch's other films. The main emotional response they're trying to evoke is horror.

That's also true of certain sequences in Jaws. The opening skinny-dipping scene is straight out of a slasher film, and the sequence where Brody and Hooper find Ben Gardner's boat is intentionally spooky, climaxing with one of the greatest jump scares in movie history. But the entire film isn't like that. Jaws is very much a cross-genre picture. Most of the pure horror scenes are confined to the first half of the movie, which plays out like a disaster film. As you point out, there are also elements of a political conspiracy at work. That post-Watergate distrust of authority figures is very typical of 1970s American cinema.

The second half of the movie shifts gear to become a seafaring adventure in the vein of Moby Dick (as musically illustrated by the score extracts you highlighted). It also exemplifies the 'ship of fools' trope common to epic poems like The Odyssey and The Rime of the Ancient Mariner. Quint, Brody and Hooper are hopelessly ill-equipped to deal with the shark and make various potentially fatal miscalculations and errors of judgement along the way. It's only through desperation and luck that any of them survive. In that sense it's also a survival-in-the-wilderness story, with the Atlantic Ocean serving as the wilderness.

If The Hitcher (1986) can be categorised as a horror movie, then so can Duel. And if Duel and The Birds can be categorised as horror films, then so can Jaws. But is Jaws a pure horror movie? Maybe. I'm going to opt for an easy answer and say I categorise it as a 'suspense thriller'.

This topic reminds me of an interesting discussion I saw on another site a few years ago concerning Nicolas Roeg's Don't Look Now (1973). That film is usually categorised as psychological horror, but it could just as easily be described as a romantic drama, a supernatural thriller, a murder mystery, a crime drama or just a suspenseful chiller. Now that I think about it, there were a lot of cross-genre films in the seventies. Take Superman: The Movie. Nowadays we'd call it a superhero film. But did superhero films really exist as a genre back then, and if not then how else would it have been categorised upon its original release? A fantasy romance? A science fiction adventure? An action disaster movie?

[thecolorsblend]

Another genre just occurred to me. With all due respect and sensitivity to our European members, there aren't very many holiday films geared to America's Independence Day. There are some, of course. But not very many. Fewer than you might think. Independence Day and The Patriot are the first ones that come to mind.

But dare we add Jaws to that list? Again, it can be argued either way.

This is my first time hearing that theory about Cloudy being Brody. Now I'm wondering what it would've been like if Popeye Doyle had gone to Amity Island instead of Marseille. I imagine Doyle and Quint would've ended up either killing each other or becoming best drinking buddies.

Drinking buddies, sure. Up to a point.

But once you get them out on the Orca hunting for the shark, it's hard to imagine Doyle submitting to Quint's leadership... esp after Quint goes ham on the boat's radio. At that point, I think you're within your rights to suggest that Doyle might've taken command of the boat (by ANY means necessary) and returned to Amity to get a stronger boat, rearm, maybe gather some reinforcements, etc. Doyle is pragmatic. And fairly ruthless. Brody (and Russo, I would argue) would obviously back down from that but Doyle wouldn't. No way. I don't love Quint's chances here.

[The Joker]

The original Jaws is getting an IMAX rerelease starting today, and I'm hoping to catch a screening over the next week or so.

Did you have the opportunity to check out a IMAX screening?

Jaws 2 (1978)

I would place Jaws 2 in the same boat (pun intended) as Psycho II (1983) and Poltergeist II (1986). All three films are unnecessary sequels to classic films made by revered directors, and all three are often dismissed out of hand for that very reason. But all three, if you give them a chance, are not that bad. They're certainly nowhere near as great as the classic films they're following, but when judged on their own merits they're decent sequels.

Jaws 2 had the same producers as the original film, and many of the cast members returned along with John Williams as composer. This lends it a feeling of continuity with Spielberg's movie that the other sequels lack. I've heard that Scheider really didn't want to make another Jaws film, but was contractually obligated to. To his credit, he gives a solid performance and doesn't let his lack of enthusiasm shine through on screen.

The biggest problems with the film are the rather dull scenes with the teenage characters, and just the overall sense of déjà vu. We've seen this all before. Jaws 2 doesn't really add anything substantial to the first film. It's a competent retread that should satisfy people hungry for more of the same, but beyond that it has little else to offer. But it's not bad.

I pretty much agree with your points regarding "JAWS 2". Where the following two sequels feel and look like entirely different beasts (even from one another), "JAWS 2" does a rather good job in keeping the tone, look, feel, and continuity of the original classic intact. Roy Scheider, Lorraine Gary, Murray Hamilton, Jeffrey Kramer, and John Williams all returning is crucial in this as well.

Following the summer blockbuster spectacle that was "Star Wars" in 1977, it was pretty much a foregone conclusion that any theoretical JAWS sequel would commit to more attacks from the shark, and the film provides that in spades. in addition to giving the shark a visually distinctive appearance with the burn scars compared to the shark's predecessor and later successor's. Whether this was a positive or negative is up to one's own perspective, but I always kinda dug it.

Plus, IMHO, the film has one of the greatest taglines in movie advertising history:

"Just When You Thought It Was Safe To Go Back In The Water"

A+ on that. A F'N PLUS!

Back to Roy Scheider, yeah to say he wasn't particularly enthused about returning to Amity one last time is a bit of an understatement. However, as Silver pointed out, you honestly can't tell by his performance in "JAWS 2", and I honestly and absolutely love his delivery during the scene where Brody is arguing with the town council, whom are all-too-quick to dismiss his claims, and says: "I'm telling you, and I'm telling everybody at this table, that that's a shark, and I know what a shark looks like because I've seen one up close! And you better do something about this one, because I don't intend to go through that hell again!"

Classic!

I'm not sure if the "E!" True Hollywood Story documentary about JAWS is posted on Youtube (it's about 20 years old now), but it was good to see that Scheider's ill feelings about "JAWS 2" had apparently lessened over the years. As the sequels are brought up near the end of the doc, and Scheider said something to the effect that even though the original "JAWS" was tough to follow, that all in all, he felt "JAWS 2" was a pretty good sequel.

If you have the time, check out this Youtuber's documentary about "JAWS 2". It's pretty comprehensive and well researched.

[Silver Nemesis]

But once you get them out on the Orca hunting for the shark, it's hard to imagine Doyle submitting to Quint's leadership... esp after Quint goes ham on the boat's radio. At that point, I think you're within your rights to suggest that Doyle might've taken command of the boat (by ANY means necessary) and returned to Amity to get a stronger boat, rearm, maybe gather some reinforcements, etc. Doyle is pragmatic. And fairly ruthless. Brody (and Russo, I would argue) would obviously back down from that but Doyle wouldn't. No way. I don't love Quint's chances here.

If Popeye Doyle was in Jaws, one thing is certain – the shark would die. Huge amounts of property damage might be incurred, Hooper might get accidentally killed in the crossfire, and Doyle might end up being put on indefinite suspension, but there's no way he'd let that shark live.

Did you have the opportunity to check out a IMAX screening?

I literally just got back from seeing it. Another amazing cinematic experience. The music and sound effects obviously come through much better with a theatrical sound system, and the frightening moments pack a lot more impact. The picture looked a little grainy blown up on the IMAX screen, but I liked that. It was the same with The Wrath of Khan when I went to see that the other week (though that was on a regular cinema screen, not IMAX), and in both cases the film grain gave the picture a degree of texture that's lacking from modern movies.

Plus, IMHO, the film has one of the greatest taglines in movie advertising history:

"Just When You Thought It Was Safe To Go Back In The Water"

A+ on that. A F'N PLUS!

For some reason I tend to associate that line with the first film. Maybe because it was used in adverts for TV showings. But you're right, it is one of the most memorable movie taglines ever. Alas, good taglines seem to have gone the way of good movie poster art. You seldom see either anymore.

Back to Roy Scheider, yeah to say he wasn't particularly enthused about returning to Amity one last time is a bit of an understatement. However, as Silver pointed out, you honestly can't tell by his performance in "JAWS 2", and I honestly and absolutely love his delivery during the scene where Brody is arguing with the town council, whom are all-too-quick to dismiss his claims, and says: "I'm telling you, and I'm telling everybody at this table, that that's a shark, and I know what a shark looks like because I've seen one up close! And you better do something about this one, because I don't intend to go through that hell again!"

Classic!

Scheider was a terrific actor. I used to watch him in SeaQuest DSV when I was a kid, but the peak era of his career was definitely the seventies and early eighties. The French Connection (1971), Jaws (1975), Marathon Man (1976), Sorcerer (1977), Jaws 2 (1978) and 2010: The Year We Make Contact (1984) are some of my favourite movies from his filmography, with Jaws ranking number one on the list. He was a more masculine kind of actor from a more masculine age. A former amateur boxer and US Air Force serviceman, his screen presence projected an air of quiet strength and stoicism balanced with human frailty and compassion. He usually played the kind of characters you'd want on your side in a scrape, and Brody is a perfect example of that.

There are many things wrong with Jaws 3 and 4, but Scheider's absence ranks high on the list.

I'm not sure if the "E!" True Hollywood Story documentary about JAWS is posted on Youtube (it's about 20 years old now), but it was good to see that Scheider's ill feelings about "JAWS 2" had apparently lessened over the years. As the sequels are brought up near the end of the doc, and Scheider said something to the effect that even though the original "JAWS" was tough to follow, that all in all, he felt "JAWS 2" was a pretty good sequel.

I enjoyed watching The Poltergeist "E!" True Hollywood Story episode on your recommendation. I'd be interested in seeing the Jaws episode too if it ever does get uploaded.

[thecolorsblend]

This thread is for discussion about Steven Spielberg's 1975 movie Jaws and its three sequels, but it can also be used to discuss any spinoffs or rip-offs related to the Jaws franchise.

In my view, it's pretty much impossible to do a shark attack movie that isn't somehow derivative of Jaws. Even if the filmmaker sets out to create a totally different kettle of fish, he's STILL influenced by Jaws from the standpoint that he's deliberately making different creative choices.

So, in that sense, you could argue that ANY shark attack movie is a ripoff of Jaws.

That's how I'm justifying this post about The Shallows.

I'll give Jaume Collet-Serra, the director of The Shallows, credit. The sinking buoy bit is rly the only thing I can think of that could be a callback to Jaws.

But for pretty much everything else, he did invest a lot of time and effort into originality. The surfer angle, the survivor/will to fight theme, it all comes together to make a pretty enjoyable little diversion.

No, The Shallows doesn't even remotely approach Jaws. But it's still a fun little movie that presents a fairly plausible (in some ways) shark attack scenario as well as defeating the shark in a persuasive enough way.

I mean, Brodie vanquished the shark in Jaws by perforating a compressed air tank. The shark's defeat in The Shallows is no more and no less believable than that.

I wouldn't go out of your way to see it. But if you get the chance to check out The Shallows, eh, there are worse ways to spend an hour and a half.

Let's face it, there's no possible way The Shallows deserves a thread for itself. So, why not piggyback on this thread, right?