Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker (2019)

[Edd Grayson]

I'll be happy to pretend that this sequel trilogy never happened. I'll probably watch The Rise of Skywalker too, but at this point I don't see how it might bring a truly satisfying conclusion for me. Disney blew it.

If I have anything positive to say about the trailer, it's that I guess the film itself might be pleasing for those who enjoyed TFA for what it was and disliked TLJ.

Perhaps.

[thecolorsblend]

I thought TDK liked TLJ?

I wrote a *LWR about Jed's Last Eye shortly after it came out, but I never ended up posting it. I still connect with points I made in that essay, but my mood for the franchise as a whole has since changed. I feel like Jed's Last Eye works best as a standalone character study rather than an episode connected to an established series. Luke as a depressed hermit worked for me more than it did for others, but at the same time, what a colossal wasted opportunity.

Is this how anyone envisioned Han, Luke and Leia returning? Is this the ideal grand comeback we fantasized about - Luke whipping out his big green one and showing the bad guys who really rules the galaxy? No, and here's the fact that must be accepted: Jed's Last Eye has now been plucked out, leaving a blind, aimless franchise scrambling for a way forward, but not stopping to breathe and reassess - burning people out in the process.

The passion of hardcore fans has been sapped. They feel cheated, let down and unsatisfied. That emotion cannot be taken away, no matter what Rise of Skywalker dishes up. But moreso for me, I think about the new characters and how they just don't stack up to the previous trilogies. Characters are what warrant re-watches, and that connection just isn't there for me. Rey is an overpowered, annoying Mary Sue. Finn and Rose are blah. Poe is blah. Hux is beyond a joke. They don't know how to write Kylo. Snoke was a cheesier Palpatine knockoff.  BB-8 is okay, but R2 has reduced to being less than a prop.

When all is said and done, I don't see this trilogy justifying its existence. What exactly has it achieved, and what progress has been made? When you are dealing with legacy characters such as Luke people have a strong sense of ownership. We have lived with them, freeze framed in 1977-1983 for the whole of our childhood and now adult lives. ROTJ left Luke in a good place, and that's how people thought of him all that time. Characters encounter obstacles, but we still want to love them. Luke should have been given a wife, kids and a functioning Jedi school that wasn't razed. As it stands, he has no legacy other than mythic ghost stories that don't amount to anything.

Legacies and how people feel about brands is really important. Disney dropped the ball big time in that regard.

*long winded rant

Those are fair points. The clear and obvious objective of TFA was to pass the reins to new characters. But there's a right way and  a wrong way to do anything.

To the degree that I ever wanted a sequel trilogy, it was the idea of a big nostalgia fest. People have been (and still are) reevaluating the prequels but those movies truly do have a lot of weaknesses. The haters weren't completely wrong. So a big heaping helping of nostalgia in a new trilogy filled with the cherished OT characters might've been just what the doctor ordered.

The story? Honestly, ROTJ left a lot on the table. I always thought that themes of reconciliation and forgiveness would be worthy follow-ups to Luke's attitude of mercy toward Vader in ROTJ. It's thirty years later and the galaxy is divided along class-oriented lines. The Inner Rim worlds savor their new freedom but the Outer Rim worlds remember only too well how much they were exploited during the latter days of the Old Republic. The Outer Rim may not have agreed with the Emperor on everything but at least he made it his business to take care of them and include them in goings on in the galaxy.

For their own part, the Inner Rim worlds see the Outer Rim as backward rednecks who refuse to see the big picture. The Emperor was a tyrant and whatever failings the Old Republic might've had, authoritarianism can't possibly be the answer.

As to the reestablished Jedi Order, they're caught in a moral dilemma. They have to take somebody's side. But whose? Inner Rim or Outer Rim? And why?

Point being that there is more than enough civil unrest to go around the entire galaxy... when A Big New Threat launches an invasion of the galaxy. The moral of the first film (and maybe the entire trilogy) could be that if both sides had shown grace, mercy and forgiveness for one another decades ago, the Big New Threat wouldn't have managed to get very far before their half-baked invasion had been thwarted.

In the final movie, the heroes on both sides can only survive and defeat the Big New Threat by putting their differences aside and uniting with each other against an existential threat. And hey, this story can be told in a way that gradually passes the torch(es) to new characters.

If Star Wars must have some sort of vague social commentary, I think the metaphor of accepting one's fellow citizens as equals irrespective of their political beliefs is a rather timely message at the moment. Any decent writer could probably come up with something better than the ideas that I just pulled out of my... hat.

Instead, it's pretty clear that Disney's eyes were focused solely on the bottom line rather than the first line of the film scripts. These sequels have been demanded for years and it's a real shame that things have turned out the way they have.

But F Disney anyway, I'm happy they're going broke on Star Wars. Serves them right.

[Silver Nemesis]

Final trailer.

It looks like the recent plot leaks were true. Oh dear.

Still, at least the music and visuals are nice.

[The Dark Knight]

Not feeling either the poster or the trailer. The poster shows just what is left of the franchise. And it's not much. It has been stripped bare with really only the Disney characters remaining, and they just don't stack up to the characters of the other trilogies. The trailer does indeed confirm the spoiler summary leak, which I have a lot of problems with. But I won't go in to those now for obvious reasons. The Matrix is my science fiction franchise of choice, so all my anticipation is centred around that. The Star Wars excitement has been diminished.

[johnnygobbs]

The story? Honestly, ROTJ left a lot on the table. I always thought that themes of reconciliation and forgiveness would be worthy follow-ups to Luke's attitude of mercy toward Vader in ROTJ. It's thirty years later and the galaxy is divided along class-oriented lines. The Inner Rim worlds savor their new freedom but the Outer Rim worlds remember only too well how much they were exploited during the latter days of the Old Republic. The Outer Rim may not have agreed with the Emperor on everything but at least he made it his business to take care of them and include them in goings on in the galaxy.

For their own part, the Inner Rim worlds see the Outer Rim as backward rednecks who refuse to see the big picture. The Emperor was a tyrant and whatever failings the Old Republic might've had, authoritarianism can't possibly be the answer.

As to the reestablished Jedi Order, they're caught in a moral dilemma. They have to take somebody's side. But whose? Inner Rim or Outer Rim? And why?

Point being that there is more than enough civil unrest to go around the entire galaxy... when A Big New Threat launches an invasion of the galaxy. The moral of the first film (and maybe the entire trilogy) could be that if both sides had shown grace, mercy and forgiveness for one another decades ago, the Big New Threat wouldn't have managed to get very far before their half-baked invasion had been thwarted.

In the final movie, the heroes on both sides can only survive and defeat the Big New Threat by putting their differences aside and uniting with each other against an existential threat. And hey, this story can be told in a way that gradually passes the torch(es) to new characters.

If Star Wars must have some sort of vague social commentary, I think the metaphor of accepting one's fellow citizens as equals irrespective of their political beliefs is a rather timely message at the moment. Any decent writer could probably come up with something better than the ideas that I just pulled out of my... hat.

colorsblend, I know you're not my biggest fan, and this comment probably won't mean much to you, but this premise is brilliant!  It's precisely the type of commentary the world needs right now, and would have made for a more satisfying and compelling story than the one we've got.

I don't want to go off on a rant, but there are people who should know better, many of them aligned to the big corporations, like Disney, who seem more interested in sowing division than coming up with scenarios that unify us all, like the hypothetical Star Wars trilogy outline you suggested.

Such a shame Disney didn't go down the avenue you've suggested but I guess, as a big corporation, it wasn't in its interest; the 'baddies' have to be found elsewhere.  Thank goodness, Warner Bros displayed some guts with Joker (a film I admittedly have some artistic misgivings about, but unequivocally cherish as a film that really does know who the real baddies are).

[Travesty]

I like the score....and that's about it. I just don't have a connection to any of these characters, and this is supposed to finish up this particular saga, and I'm just scratching my head why anybody cares. Even that 3PO line doesn't make sense, as he doesn't know this new group of people, and yet, he's making a sappy speech to them.

I dunno, it's just so bad. TLJ really messed up this trilogy. I don't think I'm gonna go see it in theaters. I'll wait for it to go to Disney+, so I guess they'll still get my money one way or another, lol. What a mess.....

[The Dark Knight]

I like the score....and that's about it. I just don't have a connection to any of these characters, and this is supposed to finish up this particular saga, and I'm just scratching my head why anybody cares. Even that 3PO line doesn't make sense, as he doesn't know this new group of people, and yet, he's making a sappy speech to them.

I dunno, it's just so bad. TLJ really messed up this trilogy. I don't think I'm gonna go see it in theaters. I'll wait for it to go to Disney+, so I guess they'll still get my money one way or another, lol. What a mess.....

Spot on Trav. That's why we feel nothing with this trailer or indeed the series now. We are prompted to care but the care factor is missing. This has the Star Wars branding but it may as well be something else. TLJ left the future of the brand feeling hollow to the point it made hard core fans lose their passion. Which is a big deal.

The Matrix sequels introduced a TON of new characters (Seraph, Niobe, Ghost, Kid, Link, Merovingian, Persephone, the Twins, the Architect, Sati, Keymaker, Trainman, Mifune, etc) but they were actually interesting. And the series did not lose sight of who the heart and soul characters are – Neo and Trinity. And they're back again for the fourth film. I have no worries with M4 casting a bunch of new characters for that very reason.

DisneyWars, however, screwed this aspect up. Give the new guys more screen-time, fine, but don't disrespect the legacy characters. That heart of soul is completely gone now. Being a Force ghost doesn't count in my book when the life lived ended in shame.

For example, I have no problem with Neo being depowered from his time as the One, given that power is transferred every cycle, just as it was to him. I even don't mind if he's not the main character. If he's a mentor like Morpheus was in the original I'm cool with that. The portrayal just has to be true to the character, and show why we loved him in the first place. Nothing of value was added to Luke as we didn't see him evolve or become a genuine mentor. Simply put, it just sucks.           

A whole new fleet will miraculously appear for TROS, but fitting everyone onto the Millennium Falcon at the end of the TLJ says it all. New characters should enrich the universe, and the DisneyWars characters don't. We actually don't really know who they are, nor do we have a reason to care. This is all just an inferior remake of ROTJ.

Animals galloping across a ship? Sorry, but I don't find that 'epic', just lame

[thecolorsblend]

I like the score....and that's about it. I just don't have a connection to any of these characters, and this is supposed to finish up this particular saga, and I'm just scratching my head why anybody cares. Even that 3PO line doesn't make sense, as he doesn't know this new group of people, and yet, he's making a sappy speech to them.

I dunno, it's just so bad. TLJ really messed up this trilogy. I don't think I'm gonna go see it in theaters. I'll wait for it to go to Disney+, so I guess they'll still get my money one way or another, lol. What a mess.....

Spot on Trav. That's why we feel nothing with this trailer or indeed the series now. We are prompted to care but the care factor is missing. This has the Star Wars branding but it may as well be something else. TLJ left the future of the brand feeling hollow to the point it made hard core fans lose their passion. Which is a big deal.

The Matrix sequels introduced a TON of new characters (Seraph, Niobe, Ghost, Kid, Link, Merovingian, Persephone, the Twins, the Architect, Sati, Keymaker, Trainman, Mifune, etc) but they were actually interesting. And the series did not lose sight of who the heart and soul characters are – Neo and Trinity. And they're back again for the fourth film. I have no worries with M4 casting a bunch of new characters for that very reason.

DisneyWars, however, screwed this aspect up. Give the new guys more screen-time, fine, but don't disrespect the legacy characters. That heart of soul is completely gone now. Being a Force ghost doesn't count in my book when the life lived ended in shame.

For example, I have no problem with Neo being depowered from his time as the One, given that power is transferred every cycle, just as it was to him. I even don't mind if he's not the main character. If he's a mentor like Morpheus was in the original I'm cool with that. The portrayal just has to be true to the character, and show why we loved him in the first place. Nothing of value was added to Luke as we didn't see him evolve or become a genuine mentor. Simply put, it just sucks.           

A whole new fleet will miraculously appear for TROS, but fitting everyone onto the Millennium Falcon at the end of the TLJ says it all. New characters should enrich the universe, and the DisneyWars characters don't. We actually don't really know who they are, nor do we have a reason to care. This is all just an inferior remake of ROTJ.

Animals galloping across a ship? Sorry, but I don't find that 'epic', just lame

These days, I get far more satisfaction and contentment from the LOTR trilogy than Star Wars. But The Matrix trilogy has much to recommend it. There were some stylistic choices made in the sequels with which I disagree. But as you say, the sequels expand the possibilities in ways which honor the original film. I don't love those films as much as you do, I gather. But I respect those movies infinitely more than I do Disney Star Wars.

In retrospect, the big regret I have with The Matrix franchise is that it never really got the expanded universe it deserved. Star Wars has had oodles of comics, novels, TV shows, video games and all sorts of things. But with The Matrix, pickings are more slim. No novels that I'm aware of, a smattering of comics, a couple of video games, The Animatrix and that's just about it, mostly. That fictional world has more potential than it ever explored. I hope that gets remedied in the years to come.

[Silver Nemesis]

His neck's not fat enough, but other than that – well played. I'll side with Team Lucas over Team Kennedy any day.

Even that 3PO line doesn't make sense, as he doesn't know this new group of people, and yet, he's making a sappy speech to them.

One of the guys at Red Letter Media made an excellent point regarding Abrams, which is that he constructs his films around emotionally-evocative images. He uses music and heavy-handed visuals to make you feel something (usually nostalgia), and that hollow sentiment distracts you from how poorly written his characters and plots are. Threepio's line in the trailer is a perfect example.

[The Dark Knight]

These days, I get far more satisfaction and contentment from the LOTR trilogy than Star Wars. But The Matrix trilogy has much to recommend it. There were some stylistic choices made in the sequels with which I disagree. But as you say, the sequels expand the possibilities in ways which honor the original film. I don't love those films as much as you do, I gather. But I respect those movies infinitely more than I do Disney Star Wars.

In retrospect, the big regret I have with The Matrix franchise is that it never really got the expanded universe it deserved. Star Wars has had oodles of comics, novels, TV shows, video games and all sorts of things. But with The Matrix, pickings are more slim. No novels that I'm aware of, a smattering of comics, a couple of video games, The Animatrix and that's just about it, mostly. That fictional world has more potential than it ever explored. I hope that gets remedied in the years to come.

I?m one of the biggest Matrix geeks you?ll find in the world. The original is my favorite film of all time. The sequels rock. I know you?re a Superman nut, so I?ll add that the Revolutions super burly brawl is exactly what I?d like to see from a Superman/super villain fight. I literally got back into the series again about four months before the M4 announcement, so the timing couldn?t have been any better. To understand my point of view, this is on equal footing with a hypothetical Michael Keaton return.

The Matrix Comics are getting a hardcover re-release next month with bonus content, and I?ve got it ordered. I think the lack of merchandise isn?t necessarily a bad thing, because it helps keep the continuity pure and more clearly defined/understandable. I am eager for more content though and I do think the new movie will bring that. Niobe is set to re-appear, so an Enter the Matrix sequel for PS5 would be pretty amazing. Lots of possibilities. I?d rather possibilities than burning out and losing interest altogether.

But back to Star Wars...

The Lucas prequels had copious CGI but they have a ton more heart, soul and fun in comparison to DisneyWars. Lucas, for all the criticism he receives, knows this saga is a space opera. He was operating in the past, continuity wise, but he greatly expanded the universe.

He clearly defined his protagonist (Anakin) in a coherent way. DisneyWars tried to replicate this with Rey but it fell flat. I think Hayden is underrated, especially in ROTS, but he did have Natalie Portman, Ian McDiarmid, Ewan McGregor, Samuel L Jackson and other memorable Jedi around him. DisneyWars has Finn, Poe and Rose played by random actors. Lucas brought in the big guns, and it just isn?t a comparison. 

The longer this franchise has been milked it has only shown how limited it really is. The Jakku opening in TFA is another desert planet ? really? Couldn?t it have been a swamp, jungle, megacity or something? Starkiller base is proudly sold as just a bigger Death Star. It?s destroyed just as easily, which is not just blatantly lazy repetition, but a cheapening of the threat level. TLJ had a Palpatine knockoff sitting on a throne, strongly evoking a scene we?ve already seen, but in an inferior way. TROS leaks again have plot beat mirroring.

There?s so much of this stuff, so you get where I?m coming from. Nostalgia kills ongoing brands. DisneyWars hoped to ride on the coattails of nostalgia, while at the same time stabbing it in the back. A strange strategy indeed, I suspect done to replace the loved characters with their own. But the new characters are forgettable. You need to have a story to tell to justify a relaunch, and seriously, what was the story that needed to be told here?