How fans are trying to remove Zack Snyder from the Justice League

[The Dark Knight]

It'd be much better if you saw the film, so you can credibly comment on things.

What gets my goat, is the notion BvS is a stinking trainwreck playing with Halle Berry's Catwoman.

[johnnygobbs]

Agreed. Far as I've seen, it's a matter of them not having the same tastes. But there is no actual agenda getting pushed against this film, I see zero evidence of there being some conspiracy of critics trying to take a film down. Especially considering Entertainment Weekly gave one of the bad reviews and both EW and Rotten Tomatoes are owned...by Warner. I guess the corporation has an agenda against itself then

Yes, I trust that EW's reviews are sincere.

I even have an old copy of EW, I bought from Ebay, that gives my beloved 'Batman Returns' a bad review.    Still, it's their opinion and they're entitled to it, and at least I know it's genuine because like you say, wouldn't a Time-Warner publication have more of an interest in saying positive things about Batman Returns and BvS, as opposed to dismissing it?

[johnnygobbs]

It'd be much better if you saw the film, so you can credibly comment on things.

What gets my goat, is the notion BvS is a stinking trainwreck playing with Halle Berry's Catwoman.

  Well, I'm probably not the best person to make such a comparison to seeing as I'm one of the few people in the entire world who actually kind of likes the Catwoman movie (mainly because I like Halle Berry and was rooting for her in the role, even if I was mostly disappointed with the results).

[johnnygobbs]

If that's true, they would never have liked Christopher Nolan's Batman, or something like Full Metal Jacket, which I like a lot, but I definitely wouldn't say it's uplifting to watch. Hell, even Batman Returns is not something I'd describe as uplifting to watch either.

As I said before, I've never taken the critics into account because I've often disagreed with what they say when they review something. Especially if they write a description that's completely unwarranted as that critic did in that BvS review I mentioned earlier on. While I won't go far to say they have an agenda, I often wonder to myself if they actually watch the same movies as I did. So no, I don't find a lot of them to be thought-provoking.

Besides, nothing is universally appreciated and let's face it, all directors take liberties from the source material when it comes to adapting comics for film. For instance, I enjoyed Iron Man 3 and I loved the Mandarin twist, and lots of critics did so too. But I can understand if somebody else who might be a dedicated Iron Man comic fan has a problem with Tony Stark's arch nemesis being reduced to being a made up disguise to hide the real terror threat - and a funny one at that. So who are the critics, and who am I for that matter, to say that their opinion should be disregarded, because they don't agree with the majority?

Well, although Batman Returns has a 80% 'fresh' rating on Rotten Tomatoes, some of the contemporary reviews were quite scathing.  Maybe BvS will undergo a similar rehabilitation in years to come.

As for Iron Man 3, I personally love that twist too, mainly because it was so well hidden from the public beforehand (these days it's very difficult to come to a film, particularly a blockbuster/CBM without knowing every single plot development inside-out half a year before its release), I got a giddy shock from wondering WTF was going on when 'The Mandarin' casually came out of the bathroom and informed his lady friends to give it a wide berth for a while (I'm sure even genuine super-villains leave just as bad a smell as the rest of us when they use the bathroom, but it's not something that is ever commented upon in films/TV shows), the twist was smart, funny, subversive and a great commentary on the terrorist bogeymen that keeps the industrial-military-complex going, and best of all it allowed the brilliant Sir Ben Kingsley a chance to play comedy (which he is excellent at, as anyone who's seen him as the terrifying yet hilarious 'Don Logan' in Sexy Beast would know).  And it was an example of having one's cake and eating it by giving us the standard Mandarin during the first half of the film via the sinister terrorist broadcasts.

All that said, if you're going to subvert a popular comic-book character it's important to do something fresh and interesting with them.  I am of the opinion this was definitely the case with The Mandarin, but it probably also helps that I was never a big Marvel/Avengers comic-book fan so I don't feel particularly precious about these characters.  By contrast I do feel much more protective of characters like Superman, Lex Luthor and Batman, and in terms of Marvel, Spider-Man, the X-Men and The Fantastic Four.

[Catwoman]

It'd be much better if you saw the film, so you can credibly comment on things.

Ding ding ding.

[Silver Nemesis]

I'm one of the few people in the entire world who actually kind of likes the Catwoman movie

[johnnygobbs]

It'd be much better if you saw the film, so you can credibly comment on things.

Ding ding ding.

No need to be rude.  And I haven't commented on the film's quality.  I've only reported the facts of what others are saying.  I don't need to have seen the film to report that.

[johnnygobbs]

I'm one of the few people in the entire world who actually kind of likes the Catwoman movie

Hey, we're all entitled to our opinions aren't we? [giveup]

That's what this whole discussion is about. 

[Silver Nemesis]

Hey, we're all entitled to our opinions aren't we? [giveup]

Oh, I'm not judging you...

That's what this whole discussion is about. 

There are dark recesses of the human heart that should remain unilluminated, some shameful secrets which should never be shared avec tout le monde. For example, I kind of like Sir Roger Moore best as James Bond, but I would never openly admit to something so shameful on a public message board like this. That's one dark secret I'll take to my grave, and none of you will ever learn of it.

[johnnygobbs]

There are dark recesses of the human heart that should remain unilluminated, some shameful secrets which should never be shared avec tout le monde. For example, I kind of like Sir Roger Moore best as James Bond, but I would never openly admit to something so shameful on a public message board like this. That's one dark secret I'll take to my grave, and none of you will ever learn of it.

Well, Timothy Dalton was my favourite pre-Daniel Craig.