#BvS SPOILER THREAD

[Wayne49]

I left somewhat disappointed. Not to say it was a bad film, but it wasn't a great one - and that's down to a number of factors.

In terms of a Snyder film, does this movie come in better or worse than MOS in your opinion?

[Paul (ral)]

Man of Steel had it's problems, but I feel it was better than DoJ.

[The Dark Knight]

What are the issues for you, Paul?

[Wayne49]

Man of Steel had it's problems, but I feel it was better than DoJ.

Thanks. Yeah, for me, MOS had a number of issues regarding character motivation and of course Snyder changing the death circumstances for Jonathan Kent. If this movie has similar motivation problems, especially since the very title of the movie suggests that should be a well flushed out idea, then this movie is in trouble with me. What I have heard regarding momma Kent has not sat well with me (both as the root of the problem and the resolution of the conflict).

[BatmAngelus]

Zack Snyder has commented on why Batman kills in the film.
http://www.comicbookmovie.com/batman_vs_superman/zack-snyder-reveals-why-the-caped-crusader-kills-in-batman-v-a132507

I tried to do it in a technical way. There's a great YouTube video that shows all the kills in the Christopher Nolan movies even though we would perceive them as movies where he doesn't kill anyone. I think there's 42 potential kills that Batman does! Also, it goes back and includes even the Tim Burton Batman movies where this reputation as a guy that doesn't kill comes from.

So, I tried to do it by proxy. Shoot the car they're in, the car blows up or the grenade would go off in the guy's hand, or when he shoots the tank and the guy pretty much lights the tank [himself]. I perceive it as him not killing directly, but if the bad guy's are associated with a thing that happens to blow up, he would say that that's not really my problem.

A little more like manslaughter than murder, although I would say that in the Frank Miller comic book that I reference, he kills all the time. There's a scene from the graphic novel where he busts through a wall, takes the guy's machine gun...I took that little vignette from a scene in The Dark Knight Returns, and at the end of that, he shoots the guy right between the eyes with the machine gun. One shot. Of course, I went to the gas tank, and all of the guys I work with were like, 'You've gotta shoot him in the head' because they're all comic book dorks, and I was like, 'I'm not gonna be the guy that does that!'

Burton's Batman is where he got the reputation for being the one who doesn't kill? Does Snyder even know what he's talking about?

I feel like at this point, Snyder shoots what's cool to him (i.e. explosions, superpowered people fighting, etc.) and justifies it later in whatever way he can. He recently compared the destruction of the planets in Star Wars: The Force Awakens to the destruction at the end of Man of Steel, which misses the point of people's criticisms completely.

He claimed that Superman snapped Zod's neck in Man of Steel so that he could learn not to kill, yet nothing in Man of Steel's ending or Batman v Superman show him learning from that at all.

Personally, I don't think that the killcount on Affleck's Batman is much worse than what we've seen of Keaton. It's portrayed in possibly a more brutal way, but Keaton still killed thugs from his vehicles by shooting at them or blowing them up (or lighting the fire breather on fire in Batman Returns).

I'm not really mad that Batman kills in the film 'cause I'm used to it (is George Clooney the only WB live action Batman not to kill anyone?), but I honestly prefer a Batman who avoids lethal force and it almost feels, as this point, that Snyder just likes to stir up controversy with the fans.

[Silver Nemesis]

I just saw this on another site and was about to post about it. It's hilarious! Let's break it down into a few key points.

There's a great YouTube video that shows all the kills in the Christopher Nolan movies even though we would perceive them as movies where he doesn't kill anyone. I think there's 42 potential kills that Batman does!

So he based his interpretation of Batman's ethics on a YouTube video edited from the Nolan films? Ok...

Also, it goes back and includes even the Tim Burton Batman movies where this reputation as a guy that doesn't kill comes from.

What the--? Ugh, moving on.

I perceive it as him not killing directly, but if the bad guy's are associated with a thing that happens to blow up, he would say that that's not really my problem.

So if Batman drops a nuclear bomb on a city, it's the population's fault for being there. Batman was merely nuking the city itself; the innocent victims were merely associated with it. How does that make a shred of sense?

A little more like manslaughter than murder, although I would say that in the Frank Miller comic book that I reference, he kills all the time.

No. He doesn't.

There's a scene from the graphic novel where he busts through a wall, takes the guy's machine gun...I took that little vignette from a scene in The Dark Knight Returns, and at the end of that, he shoots the guy right between the eyes with the machine gun.

I thought Snyder was meant to be this massive TDK fan. Has he even read it? It's amazing how Batman managed to shoot that "guy" (actually a girl) through the eyes without damaging his/her glasses.

Oh, Zack. You're making this too easy.

[BatmAngelus]

I'd say Zack's version of that scene is actually more violent than the source material.

[Paul (ral)]

I think they only looked at the pictures and not the text of DKR.

[Azrael]

That's... disappointing.

[BatmAngelus]

Great points raised by a critic whose feelings on the film are similar to mine:
http://birthmoviesdeath.com/2016/03/24/10-questions-batman-v-superman-left-me-asking