Robin's portrayal in Batman & Robin

[The Laughing Fish]

We're in a different age now with the internet. Soccer moms complaining about what they see in movies is a thing of the past. With the internet having websites dedicated to parental suggestions in movies and technology allowing for parental restriction, the onus is on the parents to ensure their children are watching appropriate content, not the film makers any more. The child in the Jungle Book encountered some dangerous situations without facing much backlash.

You're right about that, parents have no excuse to be ignorant of the content in these sorts of movies. If they're taken by surprise of something that's a lot more violent than they expected, it's their fault for not paying attention to the available resources.

But for the media, it's a different matter. I've seen some opinionated bloggers on YouTube having certain standards of what would break a film for them. For example, John Campea once made a big deal if Robin had appeared in BvS and said he'd refuse to see the film, because according to him, having a child sidekick would make Batman irresponsible. Yet, would you believe it, he was perfectly happy with Spider-Man serving as Iron Man's protege in the MCU.

Blogs and geek sites have no credibility, in my eyes.

[riddler]

A child actor wouldn't have worked in Batman Forever because of things O' Donnell does which a 12 year old character wouldn't be able to do;
-have the option to run off and live on his own instead of staying with Bruce.
-street race around Gotham rather adeptly on a motorbike
-joyride with the Batmobile.
-operate the Bat-sub
-be able to run off on his own after Bruce gets shot

Likewise Batman and Robin wouldn't have gotten away with it. The partnership in peril aspect which gets criticized enough as it is would be an extra level of silly if Dick were still a child as would him fighting over Ivy.

I think spider-man homecoming got it right; cast a 20 year old actor and put him in high school. 15-16 is about the right age for the Dick Grayson character should the DCEU portray him as Robin.

[Wayne49]

I think casting Robin too young would have also brought up an issue regarding the appropriateness of a kid being placed in harms way or being too young to make those kinds of decisions. Then you would also get into the whole father/adopted son versus what constitutes a partner at that age argument. And the list goes on from there. I think having Robin at consenting age was correct.

[thecolorsblend]

A child actor wouldn't have worked in Batman Forever because of things O' Donnell does which a 12 year old character wouldn't be able to do;
-have the option to run off and live on his own instead of staying with Bruce.
-street race around Gotham rather adeptly on a motorbike
-joyride with the Batmobile.
-operate the Bat-sub
-be able to run off on his own after Bruce gets shot

Likewise Batman and Robin wouldn't have gotten away with it. The partnership in peril aspect which gets criticized enough as it is would be an extra level of silly if Dick were still a child as would him fighting over Ivy.

I think spider-man homecoming got it right; cast a 20 year old actor and put him in high school. 15-16 is about the right age for the Dick Grayson character should the DCEU portray him as Robin.

The logical counterpoint to those things (all of which are true) is that the writers should craft a story that supports a 12-year old Robin and a 30'ish Batman. Fighting over Poison Ivy isn't it, obviously, but other conflicts could work.

To go in another direction, this kind of silly notion of Dick becoming Nightwing in BR is mystifying to me. The whole premise of BR is that Batman and Robin are becoming a team. Their challenge in BF was merely accepting the proposition of being partners. Their challenge in BF is actually becoming partners. And, in the process, they're becoming family too.

One thing I dig about BR is how Dick obviously redesigned his outfit after the events of BF. He clearly wanted to put his own stamp onto his alter ego. He was happy to use the BF outfit in BF. But after that, he wanted something sleeker and (forgive me) sexier. He's still Robin. But now he's his own conception of Robin instead of Alfred's conception of Robin.

Alfred said that Dick is following his own path and we see visual evidence of that in BR. He's fine with the "Robin" moniker as a tribute to his dead family. But he's not defined solely by that. And while the new outfit in BR is obviously intended to sell toys rather than offer commentary on the character, the new outfit still does inform the audience's understanding of how this character is growing and maturing.

[riddler]

A child actor wouldn't have worked in Batman Forever because of things O' Donnell does which a 12 year old character wouldn't be able to do;
-have the option to run off and live on his own instead of staying with Bruce.
-street race around Gotham rather adeptly on a motorbike
-joyride with the Batmobile.
-operate the Bat-sub
-be able to run off on his own after Bruce gets shot

Likewise Batman and Robin wouldn't have gotten away with it. The partnership in peril aspect which gets criticized enough as it is would be an extra level of silly if Dick were still a child as would him fighting over Ivy.

I think spider-man homecoming got it right; cast a 20 year old actor and put him in high school. 15-16 is about the right age for the Dick Grayson character should the DCEU portray him as Robin.

The logical counterpoint to those things (all of which are true) is that the writers should craft a story that supports a 12-year old Robin and a 30'ish Batman. Fighting over Poison Ivy isn't it, obviously, but other conflicts could work.

To go in another direction, this kind of silly notion of Dick becoming Nightwing in BR is mystifying to me. The whole premise of BR is that Batman and Robin are becoming a team. Their challenge in BF was merely accepting the proposition of being partners. Their challenge in BF is actually becoming partners. And, in the process, they're becoming family too.

One thing I dig about BR is how Dick obviously redesigned his outfit after the events of BF. He clearly wanted to put his own stamp onto his alter ego. He was happy to use the BF outfit in BF. But after that, he wanted something sleeker and (forgive me) sexier. He's still Robin. But now he's his own conception of Robin instead of Alfred's conception of Robin.

Alfred said that Dick is following his own path and we see visual evidence of that in BR. He's fine with the "Robin" moniker as a tribute to his dead family. But he's not defined solely by that. And while the new outfit in BR is obviously intended to sell toys rather than offer commentary on the character, the new outfit still does inform the audience's understanding of how this character is growing and maturing.

I guess you could come up with new plot lines for a young Robin.You'd be pretty much shoehorned into orphan Bruce becoming a father figure as a plot line. Burt Ward was 21 when he started his run as Robin, only 3 years younger than O' Donnell was in 1994.

I've believed from what I've read on the subject that Dick would have become Nightwing in the fifth film as in his two suits basically transition him more to Nightwing's suit; first the Nightwing patterned suit and mask with Robin colours and then the second with silver colours (closer to Nightwing's blue).  That being said I haven't thought about how the plot of Batman and Robin transitions him into Nightwing. He considers going solo and even tries it during the film. Him coming through in the end without Batman's help may have been where the arc turns sharply.
Don't forget, all but one Bat suit was destroyed by the end of Batman Forever so between films, Dick would have been on hand while new Batsuits were being built and possibly also played a hand in it. The Robin suit in Forever was likely rushed and either way was only a first draft.

It is interesting how despite having similar backstories, Bruce and Dicks paths differ. Bruce carries on his family name and legacy all along after they die. It may be due to crime fighting at an early age but Dick grows out of his families shadow and into Bruces before growing into his own. So basically what we see on screen is a suit completely embracing the flying Graysons followed by one with  a different design but the colours intact before a final suit which looks nothing like the first. Also note that this is the film in which both Bruce and Dick no longer mourn their families death  The difference is that Dick does it far quicker than Bruce.

[The Laughing Fish]

A child actor wouldn't have worked in Batman Forever because of things O' Donnell does which a 12 year old character wouldn't be able to do

I absolutely agree. But when I said "child", I was referring to 15-16. I come from a place where nobody is legally an adult till they turn 18.

It is interesting how despite having similar backstories, Bruce and Dicks paths differ. Bruce carries on his family name and legacy all along after they die. It may be due to crime fighting at an early age but Dick grows out of his families shadow and into Bruces before growing into his own. So basically what we see on screen is a suit completely embracing the flying Graysons followed by one with  a different design but the colours intact before a final suit which looks nothing like the first. Also note that this is the film in which both Bruce and Dick no longer mourn their families death  The difference is that Dick does it far quicker than Bruce.

Precisely. We must acknowledge that while both the Waynes and Graysons murders were tragic, the pain was much more profound for Bruce because he witnessed his parents' demise at such a young age. All of his childhood innocence was lost following that moment, and right till the end of Batman Forever, Bruce grew up emotionally stunted with his inability to move on with life. Batman was his only outlet.

For Dick, the trauma for him was real, but he had it easier to bounce back. He was much older when he lost his parents, he was much more street smart and aware of how unfair the world is, and he knew he could on Bruce and Alfred for support despite his rebellious attitude.

Once Bruce makes peace with his guilt over his parents and spares Dick from that destructive path towards vengeance, they healed. In the end of B&R, saving Alfred's life and having Barbara entering the fray alleviated both of them of loneliness and found a new family going forward.