The Next Villains for The Dark Knight Part II?

[greggbray]

I have a feeling the 'Catwoman' embargo will be lifted as, without Rachel, there is no strong female character in the next film, and an all male revue just will not work.

I have posted this thought elsewhere, but I have a feeling they are going to dig deeper in to the Rogues gallery, and give us a 'Hush' style mystery for part 3.  I think part of the theme will be public redemption, and part of it will deal with Batman's trials and tribulations while on the wrong side of public perception--in a word, identity.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if The Black Mask were used to be a mirror to Wayne/Batman.  He would be the heavy, but Batman would also interact with Catwoman.  Riddler could be introduced early on in the film, and at the end of the film, I wouldn't be surprised to see an epilogue ala 'Hush' with Batman and Riddler in lock up.  In other words, everyone was a pawn in Riddler's game.

This could be balanced quite well.  Nolan has been known to use multiple villains in his films:
BB: Ra's, League of Shadows, Scarecrow, Zsas, Falcone
TDK: Joker, Two Face, Scarecrow, Maroni
TDK 2: Riddler, Black Mask, Catwoman

If they opt out of the Catwoman option, the other option is Talia Head, but I truly hope she is not in the film--it would be a little 'Fright Night 2' for my taste.

Catwoman could be brought into the story via Falcone (if they decide to use his character again, or even give him a cameo, or a brief mention) a la the Loeb/Sale stories.

I think there's potential for a strong sequel.  Although I adore Burton's take on Batman, I do think TDK has the strongest script to date for Batman films, and TDK2 could possibly continue that tradition.

[The Dark Knight]

I don't think Talia al Ghul and the League of Assassins should appear. It doesn't really fit the arc of how things should progress (film #3 needs to be about Batman becoming a more permanent protector of Gotham against the new breed of freaks, not fighting some outside foe).

Poison Ivy, if utilized, shouldn't be super-powered. I have no interest in seeing some chlorophyl-powered mutant in Nolan's universe. However, her origin wouldn't have to be thrown out entirely... the experiments performed on her can be the source of her madness, but sans superpowers. (And to be honest, I wouldn't really use the character... I don't think she's particularly interesting.)

[Gotham Knight]

it would have to be a prehaps mob based, thug type character like pengy or someone along those lines. Nolan's concepts don't leave very much open and frankly, even in tdk, the mob thuggie thing was getting stale.

[Joker89]

"never say never" because you don't know what happens behind the scenes, unless of course you are writing the actual story. Even if they say "we're not using that villain." whose to say they're telling the truth? Steven Spielberg told the Indiana Jones fans that the special effects in KOTCS would be traditional effects, and guess what? They we everything but traditional. So there!

[The Dark Knight]

"never say never" because you don't know what happens behind the scenes, unless of course you are writing the actual story. Even if they say "we're not using that villain." whose to say they're telling the truth? Steven Spielberg told the Indiana Jones fans that the special effects in KOTCS would be traditional effects, and guess what? They we everything but traditional. So there!

Look, Nolan has laid down his rules. Freeze or villains similar to him will not happen on his watch. Spielberg and the abomination that is KOTCS is another story I will get into if you demand it.

Ah, I know this is off topic, but here is is anyway.

I have grown to loathe KOTCS, after going out of my way to like it as to not tarnish the series. Just as the Cannes crowd were 'respectful' to the film. Imagine if they made TOD today, the rope bridge scene would have been totally CGI, taking away the charm of it all. No threat level or danger in the film whatsoever. To me excessive CGI is just plain slack. In the days before CGI, they had to be creative and think up these situations and scenarios. I rank KOTCS last in the Indiana Jones stakes. It is not even in the same league as the first three.

I don?t know how anyone can place it above any of the originals, which have the advantage of being made back in the day. This film is going through the motions. There is nothing standout about this film except what is wrong with it. It is going to be remembered for the wrong reasons.

I know Indiana Jones is just a bunch of fun, but this was totally implausible and silly. Stupid scenes involving fridges, driving off cliffs onto rubber trees, cheesy stereotypical aliens looking directly at the camera, flying saucers, vine swinging, multiple waterfalls, computer generated ants that pull men down holes, etc. For the aliens, I'm fine with them, but it is how they are used that is absolutely terrible.

The high box office was a given. People went in expecting something similar to the first three. Except all what was happening was a cash in off memories that can not be replicated. So why try? People could have been talking about the almost mythical 'what if' regarding Indiana Jones 4 if it was never made. Well, now it is here people know exactly what they received.

I wouldn?t have made it. This film has stained the product in people?s eyes, mine included. It may have been alright if they filmed a decent script, not this nonsense. I will chose to live in ignorance that this was even made. They should have remained back in 1989 with pride, reputation and quality intact, being a cherished memory. If this is the last, it is a very poor lasting impression to leave on the audience. Even if another is made, the series runs the risk of falling deeper into the mire. It is better to fade away gracefully than to burn out.

[Atila Santos]

Johnny Depp as Riddler:

[Gotham Knight]

"never say never" because you don't know what happens behind the scenes, unless of course you are writing the actual story. Even if they say "we're not using that villain." whose to say they're telling the truth? Steven Spielberg told the Indiana Jones fans that the special effects in KOTCS would be traditional effects, and guess what? They we everything but traditional. So there!

Look, Nolan has laid down his rules. Freeze or villains similar to him will not happen on his watch. Spielberg and the abomination that is KOTCS is another story I will get into if you demand it.

Ah, I know this is off topic, but here is is anyway.

I have grown to loathe KOTCS, after going out of my way to like it as to not tarnish the series. Just as the Cannes crowd were 'respectful' to the film. Imagine if they made TOD today, the rope bridge scene would have been totally CGI, taking away the charm of it all. No threat level or danger in the film whatsoever. To me excessive CGI is just plain slack. In the days before CGI, they had to be creative and think up these situations and scenarios. I rank KOTCS last in the Indiana Jones stakes. It is not even in the same league as the first three.

I don?t know how anyone can place it above any of the originals, which have the advantage of being made back in the day. This film is going through the motions. There is nothing standout about this film except what is wrong with it. It is going to be remembered for the wrong reasons.

I know Indiana Jones is just a bunch of fun, but this was totally implausible and silly. Stupid scenes involving fridges, driving off cliffs onto rubber trees, cheesy stereotypical aliens looking directly at the camera, flying saucers, vine swinging, multiple waterfalls, computer generated ants that pull men down holes, etc. For the aliens, I'm fine with them, but it is how they are used that is absolutely terrible.

The high box office was a given. People went in expecting something similar to the first three. Except all what was happening was a cash in off memories that can not be replicated. So why try? People could have been talking about the almost mythical 'what if' regarding Indiana Jones 4 if it was never made. Well, now it is here people know exactly what they received.

I wouldn?t have made it. This film has stained the product in people?s eyes, mine included. It may have been alright if they filmed a decent script, not this nonsense. I will chose to live in ignorance that this was even made. They should have remained back in 1989 with pride, reputation and quality intact, being a cherished memory. If this is the last, it is a very poor lasting impression to leave on the audience. Even if another is made, the series runs the risk of falling deeper into the mire. It is better to fade away gracefully than to burn out.

I have to completely disagree with your thoughts of Indy4. (Sorry to go off topic) The whole point of the 'implausible and silliness' was SUPPOSED to be there. It's a B movie concept. Especially the fridge gag, which took way too much heat, was done to give you a definitive idea of the time through B movie vision goggles while at the same time showing you how much Indy is now out of place in the world. The silhouette of him against the mushroom cloud was epic proof of this. The idea was to polished it to add to Indy?s out of placeness

I think the point that was trying to be made before is that things change. Maybe when the TDK writers discover that they?ve done just about all they can with Batman generically hacking through street thugs and villains that are only really post 9/11 inspired terrorists in different outfits (Nolan?s take on Ra?s, Joker, Scarecrow) they might want to shake up a bit with someone a bit more colorful and fun (that might require some cgi) and hasn't been watered down by nolan's realism. The word here is?.fun. Something sorely lacking from a comic book film that wants to be instead be a dry as bones crime drama that clumsily meshes elements from csi, the godfather, and the untouchables.

[Joker89]

Which is why I still think they can use Mr. Freeze, The Penguin, Catwoman, etc. I mean really, why not? Just because they said so??

Like I said, Nolan can still figure out a way to make things work. He could easily base a story involving Dr. Freeze declaring war on Batman. He probably wouldn't even have to be "abnormal". He could just be a highly intelligent individual(almost an Anthony Hopkins_Silence of the Lambs approach)who makes his own freezing suit to punish his enemies.

[Cocoboloboy]

 I can see Catwoman, Penguin and Riddler fitting just fine into Nolan's world. My first choice would be Catwoman. I think she could pose a physical threat to Batman in a way that would be hard for him to deal with.
  Riddler would also be great because I think a story with him would bring out the detective side to Batman's persona that hasn't been that strong in the previous films. I wouldn't cast Depp as Riddler though. I don't see him fitting in any Batman movie.

[Joker89]

Maybe Joe Pantoliano as The Riddler? Angelina Jolie as Catwoman?