Wonder Woman (2017)

[The Dark Knight]

Just got back from seeing it, I liked it a lot.  This is in general a crowd pleasing type of film, I think it will do well.

Glad to hear that. I'm going to write a quick review once I see the movie. Look out for it.

[johnnygobbs]

Can't wait to see this.

Finally a female-led superhero movie that looks like a hit!  About time!

Good work DCEU.  And credit to Zack Snyder for casting Gal and setting up this Cinematic Universe.

[Azrael]

Let's see how the positive response affects the rest of the DCEU, Justice League especially. Yes, the credit of casting Gal Gadot and creating this version of WW belongs to Zack Snyder.

[The Dark Knight]

Paul has kindly posted my review to the main page:

http://www.batman-online.com/features/2017/6/2/golden-gal-makes-wonder-woman-shine

[Silver Nemesis]

Due to genre fatigue, I've been on something of a CBM diet of late. I skipped Logan and Guardians of the Galaxy 2, and I had intended to skip Wonder Woman. But curiosity got the better of me, what with it being a DC movie and all, so I went to see it this afternoon. Here are my thoughts.

Bottom line, it was very good. I think it's by far the best DCEU entry to date, and by quite a large margin. And not to parrot the critics, but I agree with the consensus that it's the best DC film in general since The Dark Knight. The two most obvious MCU films to compare it with are Thor and Captain America: The First Avenger; the former because of the origin story grounded in mythology, and the latter because of the historical setting. But I felt Wonder Woman surpassed both of those movies.

This surprised me, because The First Avenger is my favourite MCU origin film. Much as I like that movie, I feel it collapses under the weight of its FX-driven set pieces in the second half. It also dilutes its historical atmosphere by flooding the battle scenes with anachronistic sci-fi artillery (lasers, super tanks, those Hydra bomber jet things, etc). By contrast Wonder Woman has a much stronger final act in which the action is complimented by dramatic beats that engage your emotions, not just your bloodlust (SPOILERS: I predicted the plot twist about the villain's true identity, but I thought it worked more satisfyingly here than the similar twist in Batman Begins END SPOILERS). And unlike The First Avenger, Wonder Woman stays true to the technological limitations of its historical context. There are no laser guns or futuristic armoured suits. Just bullets, bayonets and hand grenades.

On the subject of setting, I've always loved historical super hero films. But I've never seen one set during World War I until now. WW2, sure. But not the war to end all wars. So on that score alone, the film showed me something I hadn't seen before. The fight choreography with the magical lasso was also something I've not seen in this sort of film. The fact it's a good superhero movie headlined by a female character is itself a novelty. In a cinematic genre that's rapidly growing stale, this movie stands out as surprisingly fresh. The costumes and set design conspire to create a strong wartime ambience. Jenkins' direction is solid, though she does overdo the slow-mo a bit for my tastes. I'm also not a huge fan of the CG action scenes or desaturated cinematography. But for a film that cost $149 million, they got decent mileage out of the budget. Wonder Woman has something else most modern superhero films lack, and that's a strong sense of place. We get this first in the beautiful Mediterranean locales of Themyscira, and then again with the harsh war torn landscapes of the Western Front. There's a powerful contrast between the two worlds that highlights Diana's progression from sheltered innocence, to wearied cynicism, and finally to renewed optimism.

The influence of Superman: The Movie is very apparent. There's a nice nod to Donner's film in the scene where Diana saves Steve from being shot in an alleyway.

One of the things I love about Superman: The Movie is its structure. That film has a linear narrative divided into chapters of around 20-40 minutes in length, each covering a different aspect of the Superman mythology: CHAPTER ONE – the destruction of Krypton; CHAPTER TWO – Superboy/Smallville; CHAPTER THREE – Superman's debut in Metropolis; CHAPTER FOUR – the romance between Lois and Superman; CHAPTER FIVE – Superman's first battle against Lex Luthor. It's structured like a 5-issue miniseries. Wonder Woman has a similarly neat linear structure that covers much of her respective mythology. CHAPTER ONE – Diana's origin on Themyscira; CHAPTER TWO – Diana journeys to the outside world; CHAPTER THREE – Wonder Woman on the Western Front; CHAPTER FOUR – Wonder Woman vs. Ares. And throughout all these chapters, the romance with Steve Trevor serves as a through line. It's an efficiently structured and well-paced story. It's also tonally balanced and avoids the all too common CBM pitfall of being one-note. There are moments of darkness, but there are also moments of joy. It doesn't take itself too seriously, but it also doesn't resort to self parody. It hits the right dramatic notes in the right order.

Wonder Woman herself sits atop the DCEU league tables as their most charismatic hero to date, and a lot of that is down to Gal Gadot. I've never seen her in anything outside of the DCEU, but she manages to convey strength, charm and naiveté in the correct balance. As I mentioned before, she has a broad character arc that takes her from adventurous child to veteran Amazon warrior. One of the film's central themes is personal responsibility. Diana and Steve both feel compelled to act out of compassion for the suffering of innocents. Diana believes Ares is responsible for inciting mankind to violence, and that it's therefore her responsibility to save mankind by killing him. When she discovers mankind is responsible for its own wickedness – that the war is a product of human nature, not divine manipulation – it breaks her heart and shatters her faith in humanity. That faith is then restored when Steve demonstrates the selfless heroism of the human spirit by SPOILERS sacrificing his own life for the greater good END SPOILERS. This foreshadows Superman's sacrifice at the end of BvS, which further restored Diana's faith in heroes. Her inability to stand by and watch mankind destroy itself during WW1 also foreshadows her proactive response to Doomsday's rampage in BvS. Wonder Woman can't bear to watch innocents suffer. She cares too much. This makes her an easy hero to root for.

Another thing I liked about this film was its lack of dependence on the wider DCEU. There are no forced cameos, no plugs for other upcoming DC films. It works as a self-contained, uncluttered standalone project. The closest it gets to referencing other superheroes is the letter from Bruce Wayne, and that feels totally organic and unobtrusive. It's a pleasant way of bookending the story and demonstrates the proper approach to building a shared universe – namely by doing it one piece at a time, not through cluttered ensemble films. Wonder Woman's independence also allows the movie to stand alongside Superman '78 and Batman '89 as a landmark entry in the DC cinematic catalogue. How about releasing those two films in a Trinity DVD set along with Wonder Woman '17?

Of course the film is not perfect. The supporting characters are fine, but none of them really blew me away with their individual storylines. The villains were no worse than what we're accustomed to seeing in modern superhero films, but nor were they any better (though I'd still take Ares over any character from Suicide Squad). Most CG-intensive action scenes leave me cold, and the action in Wonder Woman was for the most part no exception. And while I liked the pacing of the film, I still felt it was a little on the long side. But at the end of the day, none of these issues spoiled the film for me.

BvS demanded its audience be familiar with the source material, which was fine for comic fans but ended up alienating many casual cinemagoers. Wonder Woman doesn't have that problem. It's a fun film with a distinctive setting and likeable characters. The fact they succeeded in not making me hate Steve Trevor (or Chris Pine, for that matter) is itself a huge accomplishment. So yeah, thumbs up. Go see it. I really hope it does well at the box office so Warner Bros will give us more films like this and fewer films like Suicide Squad.

[Dagenspear]

And unlike The First Avenger, Wonder Woman stays true to the technological limitations of its historical context. There are no laser guns or futuristic armoured suits. Just bullets, bayonets and hand grenades.

TFA had that too. But the villains also had alien technology to use which they created the lasers from. Though TFA didn't have futuristic armored suits. Have a very great day!

God bless you all!

[Silver Nemesis]

TFA had that too.

The First Avenger depicted the Axis forces wielding Hydra weaponry far more advanced than any technology available in WW2. Hydra use lasers. The Nazis didn't. The portrayal of 1940s weaponry was not historically accurate.

Though TFA didn't have futuristic armored suits.

German battle dress from WW2:

Hydra armour from The First Avenger:

[The Laughing Fish]

I saw it this afternoon. Here are some of my thoughts at the moment: ***SPOILERS BELOW, so skim past this post if you don't want to read beyond this point.***

I enjoyed it, and it is a good film...but I do think it's getting overhyped.

Gal Gadot proves she's a better actress than anybody gave her credit for. Charismatic, and shows a childlike naivete that changes over the course of the plot with surprisingly capable acting skill. Not bad for a model.

While I enjoyed Diana's journey into WWI, I couldn't help but feel the conclusion doesn't gel too well with her participation in BvS. If you remember in BvS's ending, Diana had given up on humanity because she saw the horrors of what men were capable of doing. But in this film, she defies Ares' belief that humans are unsalvageable, and Steve Trevor's sacrifice helps fuel her confidence in people. I guess WWI didn't break her faith in humanity then. Something else must've happened, or over the course of the 20th Century, where she gave up until Superman fought Doomsday.

I just like to give a shout to all the critics and say: f*** YOU ALL. Once again, your hypocrisy rears its ugly when you praise another film where the good guy kills, yet you still bitch and complain Snyder's depictions of Superman and Batman as 'murderers'. Not to mention that one could've easily mistaken the film as Snyder's because it certainly looks like his. Not to mention the fact he helped co-write the story...but of course, they still can't help themselves by throwing him under the bus in their reviews.

[Paul (ral)]

Paul has kindly posted my review to the main page:

http://www.batman-online.com/features/2017/6/2/golden-gal-makes-wonder-woman-shine

Thanks for writing it for the site TDK

[The Joker]

SPOILER FILLED REVIEW





Let's be clear, as I have stated in a previous post, I had my concerns with Wonder Woman following the YUGE clusterf*ck that was Ghostbusters, and how blatant the critics completely bent over without any KY for it. HOWEVER, I am relieved to say that I was wonderfully and pleasantly surprised by just how good it actually was!

Wonder Woman, as a film, brings yet another unique DCEU cinematic interpretation that's every bit as valid as any other worthwhile interpretation we've seen thus far.

Wonder Woman, as a film, balanced the delicate act of being serious, with the stakes being conveyed as high, which is important, and yet had many moments of levity as well. However, it didn't go too FAR with the levity, which was VERY MUCH APPRECIATED. Nor did it oversimplfy things. I think one of the major reasons why the comparisons between Wonder Woman, and MCU's Captain America 1st Avenger falls flat, is that WW focused more on the horrors of war and less on the battle between a very specific evil dude and a very specific good guy. That's what Diana certainly *thought* she was doing but it's clear throughout the film to both us and the people around her that, unfortunately, the world isn't that simple.

As a guy who watches both the DCEU and MCU movies, I can assure you that I have no interest in the DCEU going Marvel-lite. I've said this before, and I'll say it again, there needs to be noticeable differences that make both universes distinct from one another. I'm happy to say that Wonder Woman did indeed keep the faith of what Snyder and company brought to us back in 2013, and is very much in keeping with that specific and unique vision. Unlike the overtly Disney family friendly fare the MCU has been consistently releasing, I could actually take the film seriously without a abundance of humor/jokes being thrown around during battles and such. Which in effect, consistently downplays the stakes. With WW, and like MOS/BvS, the decision to NOT go that route was, again, a treat to experience.

I am a dude who loved Man of Steel, really liked Batman vs. Superman, and enjoyed Suicide Squad. Wonder Woman has SS beat, and is right up there with MOS/BvS. Narratively speaking, Wonder Woman actually answers the question it raises. Is mankind worth it? In Man of Steel, I'm confident Clark is building to that conclusion. In Batman Vs. Superman, Bruce comes to believe it, but I think the film itself leaves the question open to some extent. Wonder Woman's answer, her own and the film's, is a incredibly loud, YES.

The wide eyed honesty. Humanity is worth it, but this movie makes no attempt to sugarcoat the flaws within the human condition. Humanity is worth it in spite of its flaws and, oh boy, are those flaws laid bare in this thing. From the war itself (not driven by Ares) to the broken and hurt group that accompanies Diana on her mission ... this is a film that is not afraid to show even its heroes as human and struggling to cope. Particular kudos to the ragtag group of soldiers Steve and Wonder Woman travel with. I got more out of them, than I ever did the "Howling Comandos" in Captain America: The First Avenger. One character clearly has PTSD (though OBVIOUSLY not referred to as such). We see shots of wounded soldiers being taken away from the front lines, and it's not glamorized. Nor is it black and white. While I can't speak much to the historical accuracy, it very much seems like they chose World War I very purposefully to fit the story.

Gal Gadot carrying the film as Wonder Woman!?! Well, she owns this role. No doubt about it. Not only is she a stunning visual beauty to watch, but she decisively played the role and was absolutely amazing. As good as she was in BvS, she's even BETTER in WW. Diana's real contributions are to the human side of things, inspiring Steve and his friends to keep going- Steve to sacrifice himself, and his friends to stay on beyond the time they'd agreed to. Without Diana, the gas attack plan happens and the war goes on.

One thing I very much enjoyed is that while the film conveyed that Diana is a definitely a fish out of water, they never actually go too far with it just to amp up the humor. Sure, she jumps to conclusions, but at the same time she's intelligent. She has read books. She's a quick study, and otherwise expresses about 1000% more feelings than other cinematic superheroes we've seen which come across as who can out snark who. As a consequence, I found Gal's Diana more relatable than alot of other heroes. I liked how giddy she was by just seeing a baby. To me, that highlighted the genuine warmness of the character that can oftentimes get lost when the whole 'warrior' aspect is too focused on.

The Amazons were spectacular. This movie avoided the goofy girl power tropes that I was quietly dreading, and presented Amazons that were literally awesome.  Queen Hippolyta played by Connie Nielsen was very good, actually better than I was expecting, and Antiope played by Robin Wright was excellent. For what little screen time she had, she was memorable.

Steve Trevor played by Chris Pine was very much his own character, with his own heroic sacrifice, and did not have to be led to the moment by the heroine. This, was especially noteworthy. During the final airport battle with Ares, as soon as he saw the plane, he knew what he had to do. And while Diana didn't help with that, they still helped each other. She taught Steve that you can't just focus on the goal and ignore the suffering of others, and he taught her that while mankind was flawed, it was still worthy of being saved. There was a level of balance between the two that I honestly wasn't expecting given how Hollywood is not shy about pushing some sort of agenda, and the fact that this film deviated from all that, I appreciated it.

The No Mans Land scene was one of the high points of the movie. Tone, direction, editing, score, the buildup to it, all of it was perfect. Though I have to admit, if I was a German soldier, sitting in a trench for months, and saw a woman bash a mortar shell aside with her shield ... At that point I would just have to assume I'd finally cracked! :p

The final airport fight with Ares was also magnificent. The cinematography, the pacing, the emotion, the dramatic high stakes, just fantastic. Honestly, this makes the airport scene in CA Civil War look kiddish by comparison.

Speaking of Ares, I did like him, and how he figured into the plot, but having said that, I think I would have probably liked him to be more passive, either Promethian in that he's been around trying to subtlety help humanity, perhaps for nefarious reasons (humanity is destroying itself too quickly and he needs a bigger war for reasons), or just dormant, and it's only the War to End All Wars that woke him from his slumber. However this version works very well within the narrative of the film. Ares being responsible for the deaths of the gods matches myths where Zeus is consistantly concerned where one of his sons will destroy him as he did Cronus.

So yeah, Ares as a rebellious @sshole fits great. The interpretation the film offers of the Gods is unique, and came across to me as very Christian-influenced, but considering we're talking about the Gods within the Marston/Wonder Woman mythology, differences from classical interpretation is very much on par for the course. It's the story of a supreme Creator and a lone rebel (albeit one who, in this shocking upset, wins). The other gods don't get named, let alone given a role in the story. Yeah Sacrificing Zeus doesn't come off as particularly in character with Homer's Zeus, however it does seem far more on par with the Pietas of Virgil's Jupiter. Ares has, and does work as a villain. Sure, he's not the honorable Mars but there's plenty where he's basically an bully who constantly jumps into fights and gets beaten up by the superior Athena.

In classic WW comics, it's basically Aphrodite as the Big Good, and Ares as the Big Bad, with Diana as a messiah-type figure. In the Post-Crisis era, it was Artemis replacing Aphrodite. With the film, they kinda just replaced Aphrodite/Artemis with Zeus. Speaking of Zeus, with Wonder Woman, Zeus ended up feeling like a very Christian God; he's one of only three mentioned by name (although props that the third one is Hestia), and his role is basically to be a wise and good and noble and knowing Creator. 

With the Gods, the decision to remove Aphrodite and other traditional patrons of the Amazons is kind of a weird choice... which only leads me theorize if this choice is something planned by Johns/Snyder/Jenkins to the expanded DC cinematic universe?

Since Kirby's New Gods are apparently part of the future plan, is this a possible future reference to the "time when the old gods died?".

Going back to the other villains who are not Ares, I felt the General Ludendorff character was incredibly one note. I didn't necessarily dislike him, but at the same time, he suffered in coming across like a 1960's Bond villain. Doctor Poison was more interesting, even though we're given even less time with her. I did like how both of them were both human; warmongering, ruthless, ready-to-gas-thousands humans; influenced and inspired by Ares... but ultimately, still humans, and in definitely in charge of their own actions.

With the movie origin of Wonder woman, well, I am biased. I prefer the creator's intent, and would have rathered them just stick with the Clay origin. Not a negative per say, but just of personal preference. Going the New52 route with Diana's origin where Zeus literally impregnates Hippolyta doesn't really do anything for me. Still, I like to imagine it's Zeus doing so via clay or something. I mean, Myth-Zeus had kids via sunbeam, so .. yeah ... I think he can manage.

All in all, I found Wonder Woman to be a VERY pleasant experience, and very much enjoyed it.  The story comes together and feels cohesive by the end of it. The negatives far outweigh the positives, and WW served yet another flavor different from Man of Steel, Batman v Superman, and Suicide Squad. Which I crave. I'm not sure I would put it at #1 within my own personal DCEU rankings, but again, it's pretty close if it's not!

Zack Snyder has posted he is proud of Gal and what was achieved with Wonder Woman.




He has every right to be.