Rumour: DC Comics/Justice League-based movies in development

[Edd Grayson]

I wonder how would Batman fans feel if in a new movie the Joker was actually a proxy for Sal Maroni and nothing like his usual self.

I hope you can understand why I didn't like the Mandarin twist even if you don't agree.

[riddler]

I wonder how would Batman fans feel if in a new movie the Joker was actually a proxy for Sal Maroni and nothing like his usual self.

I hope you can understand why I didn't like the Mandarin twist even if you don't agree.

A good comparison to the Mandarin is Lex Luthor (though a magical version). You could imagine how that would go down if they decided to make Luthor a buffoon.

A likely way they could bring in the real Mandarin would be to imply that the imposter was the real Mandarin's plot all along; have the fake outed to keep everyone off his scent.

As of right now I don't like the manadirn twist, ven if it was unexpected, it was a mistreatment of an arch enemy.

I'm surprised Sandman is getting a solo film priot to the Flash or Green Arrow (though the current TV series may be the reason)..

[Edd Grayson]

Luthor was already a bit goofy in the Superman films though. Mandarin definitely wasn't goofy before IM3. I agree it was a mistreatement.

I didn't even know who Sandman was. I only knew of the Spider-Man villain.

[johnnygobbs]

I wonder how would Batman fans feel if in a new movie the Joker was actually a proxy for Sal Maroni and nothing like his usual self.

I hope you can understand why I didn't like the Mandarin twist even if you don't agree.

Of course!    A lot of people feel that way and I can understand why.

Wow!  Your Joker/Maroni scenario would cause an outrage.  I'd almost like to see someone try it now.  At least it would get past the whole 'there's no way anyone could top Heath Ledger' quandary.

[The Laughing Fish]

I liked the Mandarin twist because it dared to do something really unexpected in a comic book movie. It served its purpose for the plot too; creating a fake terror threat that takes advantage of people's fears Middle Eastern terrorists to cover up the fact that the real danger was local. That, and I never cared for the Mandarin in the first place either. Then again, I think that Iron Man's rogue gallery is pretty mediocre, especially compared to Batman's rogues.

I can understand anyone was annoyed by the twist if they were dedicated Iron Man fans who had read the comics for years, but I doubt that the most casual comic fans would care too much. In fact, I'd argue that most casual fans would be more aware of X-Men villains like Apocalypse, Sabretooth and Juggernaut than the Mandarin. And besides, I don't recall that the Mandarin was considered to be a big name villain along with the Joker, Lex Luthor, Doctor Doom, Magneto etc. At least not before Iron Man 3 anyway.

Mandarin definitely wasn't goofy before IM3.

Evidently, you haven't seen the 1990s Iron Man cartoon then. 

[Edd Grayson]

Oh, I have seen it. And in season 1 everything was goofy, but in season 2 they made a superb villain out of the Mandarin, trying to reclaim his power.

However, what IM3 did was far worse than season 1 Mandarin ever was. 

Johnny, the Joker and Maroni scenario was just another extreme example, I really wouldn't want to see that. And Ledger did a good job, but his Joker could've been a lot better in my eyes.

[The Laughing Fish]

Oh, I have seen it. And in season 1 everything was goofy, but in season 2 they made a superb villain out of the Mandarin, trying to reclaim his power.

However, what IM3 did was far worse than season 1 Mandarin ever was. 

Haha, fair enough. Although despite it had so many problems, I have a great affection for the first season of that Iron Man cartoon, in a "so-bad-it's-good" way. To me, Mandarin reminded of Shredder from the original Ninja Turtles cartoon. Second season, though, I didn't enjoy it as much as you seemingly did. The animation became drab compared to the bright and colourful 1980s look of the first season. And what bothered me was that its efforts to be more serious was still undermined by poor writing. At least the first season felt like it was goofy on purpose. The sloppy writing didn't really make the Mandarin less goofy to me. I get what they were trying to do, but it looked like the show was phoned in. Shame, really.

Still, I get a laugh every time I see MODOK disguised as a baby sitting in a pram. 

[Edd Grayson]

I know what you mean. I loved the first season of Iron Man as a kid and still think it's "so bad it's good", like you do. I liked the draker tone of season 2, not all episodes were great but they were still good.


So the series as a whole is

[riddler]

Oh, I have seen it. And in season 1 everything was goofy, but in season 2 they made a superb villain out of the Mandarin, trying to reclaim his power.

However, what IM3 did was far worse than season 1 Mandarin ever was. 

Johnny, the Joker and Maroni scenario was just another extreme example, I really wouldn't want to see that. And Ledger did a good job, but his Joker could've been a lot better in my eyes.

It is an interesting discussion which Joker is better; I'll admit I prefer the mysterious Joker being completely unknown; that's what makes him such a formidable foe for Batman, he isn't looking for anything logical, he's an agent of chaos and doesn't fit any pattern nor can he be easily baited (though he was in the dark knight). I felt Ledger was a little too invincible (the joker has never been known as a physical threat. And I didn't like that Ledger subscribed to batmans no guns policy.Batman is a master fighter, the joker isn't). Jack got the luck and mannerism much better. For instance the electric hand shaker is classic joker as is laughing as he kills people. The laughing gas sequences were pretty cool.

[The Laughing Fish]

Oh, I have seen it. And in season 1 everything was goofy, but in season 2 they made a superb villain out of the Mandarin, trying to reclaim his power.

However, what IM3 did was far worse than season 1 Mandarin ever was. 

Johnny, the Joker and Maroni scenario was just another extreme example, I really wouldn't want to see that. And Ledger did a good job, but his Joker could've been a lot better in my eyes.

It is an interesting discussion which Joker is better; I'll admit I prefer the mysterious Joker being completely unknown; that's what makes him such a formidable foe for Batman, he isn't looking for anything logical, he's an agent of chaos and doesn't fit any pattern nor can he be easily baited (though he was in the dark knight). I felt Ledger was a little too invincible (the joker has never been known as a physical threat. And I didn't like that Ledger subscribed to batmans no guns policy.Batman is a master fighter, the joker isn't). Jack got the luck and mannerism much better. For instance the electric hand shaker is classic joker as is laughing as he kills people. The laughing gas sequences were pretty cool.

The most annoying thing that put me off about Ledger's Joker, apart from the over-exaggerated praise for his character, was the the hype around the pencil trick scene. I thought it was just a somewhat unique little idea that was blown WAY out of proportion, and pales in comparison to the scene where Nicholson's Joker electrocutes Rotelli to death with a hand-buzzer, while mocking him until he turns into a charred corpse.

If anything, the only part I actually liked about Ledger's Joker was towards the end of the penthouse scene, where Batman tells him to let go of Rachel, and Joker replies "Very poor choice of words!" and pushes her off the edge of the building. That's it. That was the only time I felt that Ledger was playing a character that resembled anything like the Joker. Ironically, for all the praise that people heap on his performance, nobody ever talks about that scene at all. Go figure.