Most tragic moment in the Burton films?

[The Laughing Fish]

I reckon the saddest moment out of both films was Selina Kyle suffering from a mental breakdown and destroys her apartment - right after she survived Max Shreck's attempt to kill her. It's really a gut-wrenching scene. Especially telling how she destroys her stuffed toys and dollhouse as if she lost her childhood too, upon becoming Catwoman.

Thoughts? Are there other sad scenes that I didn't mention in the poll?

[johnnygobbs]

I voted for the death of Bruce's parents which is a powerfully shot moment in the Burton film.

I'm not sure if the Joker's death deserves to be there.  Was he really that tragic?

Also, was anyone left upset by the Ice Princess's unnecessary death or was she too silly a person to consider tragic?

What makes one character's death more tragic than another's?  It' a serious question.  Not a judgement.  And I'm fascinated to read other posters' thoughts. 

[The Laughing Fish]

I'm not sure if the Joker's death deserves to be there.  Was he really that tragic?

The only part that was 'tragic' about the Joker's demise was there would be no more laughs at his antics. But Joker was far from tragic - unless people argue that his descent into complete insanity after his fall into the chemical waste is tragic in some way.

The scene with Selina having a mental breakdown, like I said, is sad because of how fragile one's psyche can be that it reaches at a boiling point and she sheds away everything about herself that was child-like into becoming more edgy.

[Cobblepot4Mayor]

I voted for the death of Bruce's parents which is a powerfully shot moment in the Burton film.

I'm not sure if the Joker's death deserves to be there.  Was he really that tragic?

Also, was anyone left upset by the Ice Princess's unnecessary death or was she too silly a person to consider tragic?

What makes one character's death more tragic than another's?  It' a serious question.  Not a judgement.  And I'm fascinated to read other posters' thoughts. 

I must admit I've always thought the Ice Princess' fate was more "black comedy". The way she hits the ground and the dumbstruck reactions from the Mayor and his aides just makes it kinda funny for me. The Penguin's to blame for triggering such reaction with the hilarious line: "RATS WITH WINGS DO YER THINGS!".

[Cobblepot4Mayor]

I reckon the saddest moment out of both films was Selina Kyle suffering from a mental breakdown and destroys her apartment - right after she survived Max Shreck's attempt to kill her. It's really a gut-wrenching scene. Especially telling how she destroys her stuffed toys and dollhouse as if she lost her childhood too, upon becoming Catwoman.

Thoughts? Are there other sad scenes that I didn't mention in the poll?

I had the exact same reaction as a kid to her destroying her childhood items. Found it extremely disturbing when I was five lol Danny Elfman's tragic music hightens it all to a "t". That for me is the greatest scene in the Batman films because it's really the only time we truly witness a Bat villain completely break down and descend into their madness. EVERY Batman foe has had a dark moment like that as we all know.

The only other time they did a similar thing was in The Dark Knight where they had Harvey Dent scream (albeit silently) at the site of his scarred coin and the memory of Rachael. And you know he's completed his transformation into Two Face. It too was a powerful moment that almost reached the scale of the Selina scene.

But it's Oswald Cobblepot who defines tragic for me everytime. Can't believe Devito was nominated for a Razzie award for his amazing work. How stupid was that? Him visiting his parents grave tugged on my heartstrings. I think it's the scene that introduced me to the notion that one day your parents will "leave you". Now having lost my own dad it really hits home (as does Johnathan Kent's death scene in the first Superman). For me it's the thought of him being alone in the world that frightened me as a kid. Plus the fact people keep leaving him (his henchmen ditch him at the end and even the family of penguins). Therefore he dies alone and abandoned as he was at birth. His life one big circle of tragedy. I always imagined Batman on watching his death understood that in some way and this is why he chooses to "bear witness". It not just triumphantly seeing the fall of the bad guy. And they say Burton Bat films aren't deep enough! Ppfft.

[johnnygobbs]

I voted for the death of Bruce's parents which is a powerfully shot moment in the Burton film.

I'm not sure if the Joker's death deserves to be there.  Was he really that tragic?

Also, was anyone left upset by the Ice Princess's unnecessary death or was she too silly a person to consider tragic?

What makes one character's death more tragic than another's?  It' a serious question.  Not a judgement.  And I'm fascinated to read other posters' thoughts. 

I must admit I've always thought the Ice Princess' fate was more "black comedy". The way she hits the ground and the dumbstruck reactions from the Mayor and his aides just makes it kinda funny for me. The Penguin's to blame for triggering such reaction with the hilarious line: "RATS WITH WINGS DO YER THINGS!".

You may be right Cobblepot4Mayor but what makes her unnecessary fate a joke and some of the other character's fates sad and tragic?  She's still a human-being so why is her death funny and the other characters' deaths sad?  I'm not saying you're wrong.  I'm just curious about how it works. 

[Catwoman]

split down the center.

[Azrael]

An additional small melancholy moment: Bruce moping in his study while everyone else celebrates Christmas.

[johnnygobbs]

An additional small melancholy moment: Bruce moping in his study while everyone else celebrates Christmas.

I like this one. 

Although they weren't celebrating by the time we see him.    And not 'everyone' was even celebrating to begin with (at least not the Penguin or Selina).

But it's a great pick nonetheless and I agree with the overall sentiment.  Almost everyone else but him is enjoying Christmas.

[The Laughing Fish]

I had the exact same reaction as a kid to her destroying her childhood items. Found it extremely disturbing when I was five lol Danny Elfman's tragic music hightens it all to a "t". That for me is the greatest scene in the Batman films because it's really the only time we truly witness a Bat villain completely break down and descend into their madness. EVERY Batman foe has had a dark moment like that as we all know.

If you mean a character who was once innocent who completely falls apart and becomes insane, then yes, that's exactly what I meant too. Jack Napier staring at his own reflection in the mirror and having a psychotic breakdown may have been creepy too, but he was already a heinous human being long before he became the Joker. With Selina Kyle though, she transforms from this quirky office girl into something more deranged and seductive, yet sympathetic at the same time. And Elfman's butterfly toy box-like music definitely captures the mood of that scene; really heartbreaking stuff. 

The only other time they did a similar thing was in The Dark Knight where they had Harvey Dent scream (albeit silently) at the site of his scarred coin and the memory of Rachael. And you know he's completed his transformation into Two Face. It too was a powerful moment that almost reached the scale of the Selina scene.

Unfortunately, I disagree. Any sympathy for Harvey Dent got flushed down the toilet as soon as he quickly became the second villain of the movie, as well as being manipulated by the Joker - despite that Joker was the one who a played a part in Harvey and Rachel's tragic outcomes. It would've made a lot more sense if Harvey's descent to madness was gradual and actually showed convincing signs of instability beforehand, instead of the rushed and illogical way it was done in the movie. It was such a piss-poor excuse for character development.

But it's Oswald Cobblepot who defines tragic for me everytime. Can't believe Devito was nominated for a Razzie award for his amazing work. How stupid was that? Him visiting his parents grave tugged on my heartstrings. I think it's the scene that introduced me to the notion that one day your parents will "leave you". Now having lost my own dad it really hits home (as does Johnathan Kent's death scene in the first Superman). For me it's the thought of him being alone in the world that frightened me as a kid. Plus the fact people keep leaving him (his henchmen ditch him at the end and even the family of penguins). Therefore he dies alone and abandoned as he was at birth. His life one big circle of tragedy. I always imagined Batman on watching his death understood that in some way and this is why he chooses to "bear witness". It not just triumphantly seeing the fall of the bad guy. And they say Burton Bat films aren't deep enough! Ppfft.

And of course, Penguin's death tops off the sombre mood of the movie; no contrived happy endings here. Not only did Batman lose another chance at happiness, but he had to be proven right that the freak with a sob story had a grotesque agenda all along, whose demise was a poetic end to a very sad life.

People can complain about the plot in Burton's films, but they're only kidding themselves if they say the characters are simple.

My condolences for your dad's death by the way.