The Killing Joke

[The Laughing Fish]

I read The Killing Joke three years ago, so I'd like to share my thoughts:

I thought it was a rather good story. I liked how the Joker's backstory was told and then it was muddled when he admits to telling different stories about his past - "the multiple choice". Totally demonstrates his sick sense of humour.

I got to say though; did anyone else get the impression that the events that "supposedly" happened in the Joker's backstory might have had some truth behind it? In the end, Joker looked rather remorseful when Batman tried to offer him a chance for rehabilitation, but he apologetically rejects it because he thought it was too late - as if he knew his crimes were too unforgivable. In this story, I always thought the Joker wanted to be understood so badly about losing his mind after "one bad day" that he believed driving a sane man like Gordon crazy would get people to see where he was coming from. I guess one could say that Batman and Joker are two opposites of each other despite
both having similar tragedies; the former endures his grief over the loss of parents but takes it as a motivation to fight off crime for the good of the city, the latter loses his mind completely and tries to demonstrate his point about how worthless life is.

One thing that bothered me about this book though is the violence. I've always had a hard time getting through the Joker's assault on Barbara Gordon, and even the assault on Commissioner Gordon at the theme park where he had to endure enlarged photographs of his bloodied, naked daughter. Ugh. Frank Miller, ear your heart out. Even Alan Moore admits to feeling uncomfortable with it.

[thecolorsblend]

Except for the more graphic pages, I always thought The Killing Joke was a fairly pedestrian story redeemed mostly by the art. I don't think Moore was firing on all cylinders when he wrote it (as compared to Watchmen, his masterpiece).

Also, I never bought the "multiple choice" thing. It feels a lot like a copout. Sh!+ or get off the pot. Don't show an origin that was canon for decades and then suggest it might not be true. Either it is or it isn't. Make up your mind.

Still, the editors didn't sweep TKJ under the rug. It "happened", it gave us Oracle (although Babs is feeling better these days, I guess) and some other good stories. But part of me can't help but feel it's exemplary of that 80's and 90's darkness decadence stereotype.

But I still enjoy it because Marvel has literally published nothing of such historical impact and my inner DC guy will always love rubbing it in.

[The Dark Knight]

'Falling into the acid' is my 100 per cent favoured Joker origin. And it's the only one I'll take. B89 bettered TKJ but making him a mobster. There's his grounding in being a street smart, etc. In my opinion The Joker absolutely knows his origin and the 'forgetful' histories angle is all a ruse.

[thecolorsblend]

'Falling into the acid' is my 100 per cent favoured Joker origin. And it's the only one I'll take. B89 bettered TKJ but making him a mobster. There's his grounding in being a street smart, etc. In my opinion The Joker absolutely knows his origin and the 'forgetful' histories angle is all a ruse.

The mobster and failed comedian both work for me. The mobster thing for the reasons you mention; the failed comedian for the role it continues to play in his psychology (ie, he kills everybody who doesn't get the joke... which is everybody because he's a crap comedian).

[The Laughing Fish]

'Falling into the acid' is my 100 per cent favoured Joker origin. And it's the only one I'll take. B89 bettered TKJ but making him a mobster. There's his grounding in being a street smart, etc. In my opinion The Joker absolutely knows his origin and the 'forgetful' histories angle is all a ruse.

I heard somebody in a podcast who reviewed B89 was saying the best thing about the Jack Napier backstory was making him as Grissom's right hand man made it believable that he could take over the criminal empire. As opposed to being a criminal who appears out of nowhere but suddenly gains control of all these henchmen working for him.

Nonetheless I always thought, as Colors suggested, the Joker also works well as a psychopath who murders people out of vanity; a kind of psycho who gets upset when somebody who steals his spotlight.

[The Dark Knight]

The comedian angle can easily be tied into the mobster, too. Someone who has a unique sense of humour from the outset, but lets it rip once transformed. It kills two birds with one stone.

[The Laughing Fish]

^ Good point. No reason why it has to be one or the other.

Anyway, I find it interesting to read Moore criticizing his own work; regards The Killing Joke rather lowly:

"I don't think it's a very good book. It's not saying anything very interesting."

Ultimately, at the end of the day, The Killing Joke is a story about Batman and the Joker; it isn't about anything that you're ever going to encounter in real life, because Batman and the Joker are not like any human beings that have ever lived. So there's no important human information being imparted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman:_The_Killing_Joke#Critical_reception_and_legacy

Then again, I've yet to hear anything positive from this guy. He makes me wonder if there's anything he does like.

[thecolorsblend]

If you wrote what you thought were some decent comics but everybody treated you like Jesus for having written them, you have two options:

01- Accept their borderline worship as proof of your epic splendor (see people like Mark Millar for more on this).

02- Develop an unnecessarily critical (borderline hostile) opinion of your books to balance it out, acquainted as you are with your and their shortcomings and weaknesses... which I think is what Moore has chosen to do.

[Silver Nemesis]

The Killing Joke is highly overrated in my opinion. When I was a teenager I used to think Moore was brilliant. But I find the older I get the more critical I am towards his work. Some of his writing – in particular his early stories for the Doctor Who comics, 2000 AD (The Ballad of Halo Jones, Future Shocks, etc) and the excellent Watchmen – are worthy of the praise they receive. But a lot of his stuff – V for Vendetta, The Killing Joke and The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, to name a few – I find grossly overrated. But that's just my opinion.

The Killing Joke is typical of Moore's revisionist technique of appropriating other writers' creations and subjecting them to his own brand of nihilistic cynicism (the most offensive example of this being his graphic novel Lost Girls). One thing modern editors and critics are very wary of is writers who use violence against women, and particularly sexual violence, as a cheap plot device to get an emotional response from their reader. Nowadays it's regarded as bad writing 101, but Moore did it all the time back in the eighties and nineties. Supergirl gets assaulted and mutilated in 'For the Man Who Has Everything', Mina Harker gets sexually assaulted in The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, and of course we all know what happens to Barbara Gordon in The Killing Joke. There's a nasty vein of misogyny running through much of Moore's work that I find extremely distasteful. So I can't honestly say I'm a fan of his, even though admitting as much is tantamount to heresy in the comic book community.

However I'll give credit where credit's due, and Moore did write a very good Batman story called 'Mortal Clay' in Batman Annual #11 (1987).



It's one of the best Clayface stories ever written, but sadly tends to get overshadowed by TKJ. It also has some striking parallels with Tim Burton's music video for The Killers song 'Here With Me'. The comic came out in 1987, around the time Burton was prepping his Batman movie. And we know Burton was a fan of Moore's work, so it doesn't seem too improbable that he might have read this story.

A few similarities:

•   The protagonist projecting his love for a real woman onto a lifeless mannequin
•   Themes of possessiveness, obsession and unrequited love
•   The protagonist stealing the mannequin and taking it back to his lair
•   The scene of them sitting opposite one another at a dining table
•   The wax motif; the Preston Payne Clayface resembled a melted candle and often set up base in abandoned wax museums

[Silver Nemesis]

According to Grant Morrison, Batman kills the Joker at the end of this book.

I've never heard about this interpretation until now. It actually makes me appreciate the book a bit more.