John Blake (SPOILERS)

[ElCuervoMuerto]

Blake was one of the things I liked the best about this film. I think it fit the tone of the film and series well, and gave us a good way to finish the trilogy while continuing the story in our heads.

[BatmAngelus]

It hit me earlier this evening that a clue to the Robin ending was dropped over a year ago.

Last year, I remember that word had leaked out that the Dark Knight Rises crew was looking for a location for "Robin's Cave."  Pretty much everyone dismissed this as a red herring.
http://spinoff.comicbookresources.com/2011/02/07/will-robin-rise-alongside-dark-knight/

Now that the movie's out, I'm pretty confident that they were actually looking for the exterior of the cave that Blake finds at the end of the movie before rope-swinging in.

Son of a...

[The Dark Knight]

One thing that is never resolved, or should I say logically explained, is the entry and exit into the batcave.

We see that the waterfall is obviously still there, but no bridge type thing leading up.

Say that such a construction gives away the location, but I find it silly. Such a structure could raised and lowered ala the batcave cube we see in the movie.

In TDK he's operating from the bunker. TDKR skirts around this by not giving Bruce another Tumbler.

But when he had one in BB he was boost jumping in and out. Which is ridiculous, extremely dangerous and not a long term way of dealing with things at all.

But in TDKR he still had the batpod, and it is logical to assume he jumped in and out in the same fashion. Right....

Or, he wheeled the thing into the elevator, through Wayne Manor, out the door and drove out from there.

[BatmAngelus]

Best not to think about it, Dark Knight.  Clearly, the filmmakers didn't.   

The Batcave inconsistencies are annoying, though.  If my memory's correct and I'm right about the Robin's cave thing, then the waterfall opening in TDKR wasn't even the same as the one in BB.

To add to that, how is there a new Batcave when Batman's been retired since The Dark Knight?  Either it was around during the time of The Dark Knight (in which case, why wasn't he using it?) or Bruce finished building it during his retirement (but why would he bother?).

Anyways, back to Blake...

I've determined that Blake is my favorite character in the movie.  And the reasons why are precisely why he's a problem in the movie, too.

I mean, who shows up at a crime scene to investigate a boy's death? 
Who rescued Jim Gordon after he tumbled out of the sewers? 
Who caught Selina Kyle?
Who figured out what Bane would do to the cops when they went down into the sewers? 
Who went out to save Jim Gordon against League of Shadows members at the hospital? 
Who risked his life out in the streets, past Bane's men, during the No Man's Land period to gather supplies and recruit cops?

Not Batman.

John Blake does all of this.  This guy is smart (I'd say conveniently smart at times, but it doesn't change the fact that he's a step ahead of many of the characters in these scenes).  He's proactive.  He cares about Gotham and other people. 

I couldn't help but root for this guy more than Batman because, let's face it, Blake is getting most of this crap done while Bruce is either limping around Wayne Manor or doing angry sit-ups in The Pit.

Which is why he's a problem in the movie.  He does a ton of things that either Batman or Jim Gordon should've been doing, if the writers had kept the focus on the pre-established main characters.  Blake wasn't in the previous movies, yet suddenly, he becomes a protagonist when Bruce is out of commission, he's got a shoehorned backstory with Bruce, and takes on the mantle at the end.

In some ways, I was glad that Blake got the Batcave at the end.  I thought he kinda deserved it, since it seemed like he was the only one of the good guys who had his crap together (I've cited that it's the only part of the ending that I really liked).  But, as I've previously discussed with posters here, the character never demonstrated any physical martial arts skills for us to believe that he'd survive long as the next guardian of Gotham either.

It's weird to say, but I think the fact that I liked Blake's character better than everyone else (including Batman himself) is another reason why the movie didn't work for me.

[thecolorsblend]

To add to that, how is there a new Batcave when Batman's been retired since The Dark Knight?  Either it was around during the time of The Dark Knight (in which case, why wasn't he using it?) or Bruce finished building it during his retirement (but why would he bother?).

Eh, I could kinda No Prize that by saying that it was already planned that the Manor would be rebuilt, obviously. My contention then is that the first thing that would be done is redesigning and setting up the Batcave. After that, construction on the main property would commence. To me that's just the logical way to do it. All you'd really need to do is cover over the entrance to the Batcave and include a section in the blueprints where you'll later come back to install the Manor entrance.

Of course, this raises the challenge that the entire Manor was rebuilt inside of at most a year. I'm not an expert on construction by any means so maybe a project of this magnitude is absolutely doable if you've got a full 12 months to work with... but then TDK doesn't necessarily take place a year after BB. But it can't take place more than a year later. So there's a problem with the timeline even if you buy into the above solution.

So I guess in the end all I managed to do was half-ass answer your question and then ask a question of my own. Oy...

[BatmAngelus]

^ That also brings into question how Bruce would get the construction crew in there and avoid suspicion.  Maybe they just thought it was his secret basement?

Anyways, you're certainly right that the rebuilding of Wayne Manor would've lead to the rebuilding the Batcave as well.  After all, Begins ends with Bruce and Alfred agreeing on renovations to the "southeast corner." 

The best explanation I can think of, regarding the timing, is that the Batcave construction finished up during the events of The Dark Knight, but before the new Wayne Manor was finished.  After all, it takes less time to build a superplatform with a plexiglass case than it does to rebuild an entire mansion.

So, since the mansion was still under construction, Bruce remained at the penthouse and it just made more sense for him to use the bunker than to go all the way back to the new cave to suit up.  But then, he killed Two-Face and he quit the cowl.  During his eight year hiatus, Wayne Manor was finished and he moved back in, but the Batcave was never used until Alfred found him in TDKR.

[riddler]

generall i have no issue bashing this film but i can give it the benefit of the doubt here; the dark knight ends a year after begins and since being batman is more of a priority than being bruce wayne, not hard to fathom rebuilding the cave is his priority. It does seem half finished in TDKR

[thecolorsblend]

^ That also brings into question how Bruce would get the construction crew in there and avoid suspicion.  Maybe they just thought it was his secret basement?

Maybe Lucius Fox had a hand in it. Of course, he seems to do everything except change Bruce's socks for him.

[The Dark Knight]

It's funny how Blake kills those cement truck guys and throws away his gun, seemingly making a choice not to use it any more, disgusted with his actions.

Soon after he's charging the hospital with a shotgun...

[BatmAngelus]

Wasn't sure where else to post this, but here it goes.

Drew McWeeny at HitFlix is considered legit  (I've read that he was the one who first reported Liam Neeson's cameo in TDKR, among other things) and reported this last night:
http://www.hitfix.com/motion-captured/exclusive-is-joseph-gordon-levitt-already-set-to-play-batman-in-justice-league

The Cliff Notes of this:
- Joseph Gordon-Levitt could be reprising his role as (Robin) John Blake as the Batman of the Justice League movie
- "Potentially one other actor" from the Nolan films may be crossing over into the Justice League universe, too.  (Morgan Freeman as Lucius Fox to give Blake more gadgets?).
- Drew speculates that JGL could have a cameo in Man of Steel, based off the fact that DC and WB have been looking at how Marvel used cameos to establish the interconnecting universe and tease future films.

Look, I get it.  WB wants to connect Justice League to Nolan's after the trilogy was such a popular success.  It'd be far easier for them to jump off of TDKR and bring in Bruce's successor in the Batsuit than have Christian Bale return or start with a new Bruce Wayne actor for a reboot.

And as stated earlier in this thread, I like JGL.  I liked John Blake. 

But Nolan's Batman universe needs to die with TDKR.  Whether you loved or hated the movie, this is exactly what Nolan intended- the end of the story.  Even JGL acknowledged that on Jimmy Kimmel. 

Not to mention the biggest problem, which is that, if this is true, the Bruce Wayne Batman would not be the one in Justice League movie sharing the screen. 

To me, this is the equivalent to having Don Cheadle's War Machine in The Avengers movie instead of Robert Downey Jr.'s Tony Stark.  Sure, the character's established and they've got a solid actor in the role...but it's not the character who's leading the franchise.  A different character in the suit is a different character entirely.