The signature scene - Things Change

[Bobthegoon89]

Is Batman's "Thing's Change" moment the signature scene in all of Batman Returns? I believe so and I remember the marketing people sure as hell played that moment on clips shows to death in '92. You would think it a moment that they would've had under lock and key and yet I think it was that one clip that got excitement brewing the most. You don't really get scenes like that anymore in superhero pictures where the filmmakers signpost the excitement of having these characters as real flesh n blood people meeting on screen for the first time.

The interesting thing about this scene that took me years to notice frankly is that it's the only time all 3 leading characters actually meet. And there is just a very quick shot (the department store exploding) in which their all in the same frame. Never again does Batman face Catwoman and The Penguin in the same scene. I like to think this formula may have inspired Nolan's way of handling the "double threats". In Batman Begins although we're told Ra's al Ghul and The Scarecrow were in cahoots (based on a lie mind you) we never saw them together. And in Dark Knight Two-Face and The Joker have just a single scene together (the excellent hospital discussion).

To me writing the villains this way can be almost be more interesting. Seeing them interact is fun and essential too but I wouldn't ever want them challenging Batman at the same time. Schumacher fell into this trap in Forever where Two-Face just stood around The Riddler's throne room and you barely notice he's there. Believe it or not Schumacher improved this in Batman and Robin where he wisely split up Poison Ivy and Mr Freeze for the finale and you have this nice double whammy of differing showdowns. Batman Returns goes two steps further first getting rid of The Penguin and only then bringing in Catwoman for a second showdown. And I remember as a kid being greatly surprised when The Penguin rises up again from the depths and you think hang on, this battle's still not over yet lol

Some people hate the whole having two or more villains thing in movies but I love it and think the Batman movies played a massive part in establishing that method. I do think it works better and more intelligently with Batman having to face the challenge of two villain subplots rather than them teaming up and launching a single campaign against him.

[thecolorsblend]

In Schumacher's defense, Batman and Robin had to have separate showdowns with Two Face and the Riddler. Robin obviously had less business with Riddler but they both had business with Batman which, honestly, would've been hard to resolve any sooner in the narrative than Goldsman did it. Two Face was hardly an inactive bystander in the finale though. He directly pursued Robin and captured him. Then he attacked Batman, Robin and Chase. He didn't do all that much during the Riddler's monologue but I don't see that necessarily as a negative.

[BatmanFanatic93]

Well if i may in a deleted scene in the batman forever dvd there's a extended scene of the helicopter fight between batman & two-face and in the fight two-face in one part says "Theres only way out of this waltz somebody dies!" which mean't one person has to die in order to stop the chaos i don't know if that was a signal that two-face was gonna die at the end or something else but i thought it was interesting to bring it up.

[Catwoman]

that is a great scene. i never thought of it being the only time they all meet.