Your Version of Batman Returns

[The Dark Knight]

Instead of killing off both of The Penguin's parents I'd have kept one still alive and him encounter that parent on his return to Gotham as an adult. Maybe to inherit the fortune that's rightfully his?

The Penguin was a dark mirror of Bruce. Both lost their parents. One was loved and inherited the money. One was rejected and received nothing but a sewer upbringing. It all comes to a head in the subtle scene of Bruce is watching the news report. You can see his mind ticking over about the situation. "His parents...I hope he find them." Both parent deaths shape their futures and mindsets.

[gordonblu]

I'd include the roller coaster sequence from Waters' draft, just to get a little more action during the finale.

[Silver Nemesis]

I wanted to see The Penguin encounter Bruce Wayne himself as there are obvious great parallels (as highlighted by Paul Dini on the documentary). Maybe they did things more subtle in the final film but I now think it was a missed opportunity to bring Bruce Wayne into the wealthier side of The Penguin's public face and explore that.

I've never thought about this before, but that's actually a great suggestion. I liked the fact we got to see Bruce meet Napier in the first film, and it would have been cool to have a similar scene with Cobblepot in this movie. It would have added extra symmetry to the "thing's change" scene, like the two mistletoe scenes had.

Another thing I'd have changed about Batman Returns would be to increase the police presence throughout the movie. The GCPD make a weak attempt to quell the riot at the start of the film, but aside from that they just stand by and let the Red Triangle Gang run amok in the streets. I know this was meant to convey the ineffectiveness of the police force, but later on they show the cops coming out in full force to pursue Batman. Where were those cops earlier in the movie when the Penguin's thugs were terrorising people? They could have shown some police cars arriving on the scene at the beginning of the second riot, only to be shot to pieces by the Penguin's goons.

A simple way of increasing the police presence in the film would be to add GCPD dirigibles over the city like in Batman: The Animated Series. This would've been a nice nod to early Golden Age stories like 'Batman Wars Against the Dirigible of Doom' (Detective Comics #33, November 1939), as well as an indicator that the GCPD were at least trying to keep the city safe. The dirigibles could also have been incorporated into certain scenes in the movie.

For example, I've always felt there was a distinct lack of urgency in the scene were Batman escapes from the rooftop using his glider cape. The cops are after him, but they're nowhere to be seen. I'd have had a dirigible appear overhead just as Batman is plucking Catwoman's claw from his armour. It shines a searchlight on him and the pilot calls down from the address system and tells him to surrender. Batman then goes and stands on the wall like he does in the finished film. The pilot says "we have him now" and positions the searchlight directly above him. It would look as though Batman was trapped inside the pillar of light. But to the pilot's surprise, his costume would sprout glider wings and he'd dive off the roof. You'd then have that wonderful shot of Batman gliding down into the plaza, only now with the dirigible hovering in front of the full moon up above. Visually it would look great.

I'd also add a blimp to the scene where the Red Triangle Gang are stealing the children. You'd have to show the police at least trying to stop them, so I'd have several dirigibles hovering overhead and shining searchlights down into the streets. Suddenly all the searchlights converge on a single spot, drawing all the Red Triangle Gang members' attentions to that one focal point. Then we'd get a POV shot of their perspective, staring up into the blinding light as the silhouette of a bat descends on them from above. We'd then cut to another Red Triangle Gang train (let's face it, they'd need more than one to steal all the firstborn children in the city) where we see Batman's shadow appearing on the wall, just like it does in the finished film. There'd be a little montage showing him stopping all the trains and it would end with him throwing the final gang member inside one of the cages, locking the door and then throwing the keys to Gordon as he and the other cops arrive and take over.

Having Gordon show up at the end of that sequence would also allow for a conversation between him and Batman where the latter is exonerated of the charges against him.

[johnnygobbs]

I wanted to see The Penguin encounter Bruce Wayne himself as there are obvious great parallels (as highlighted by Paul Dini on the documentary). Maybe they did things more subtle in the final film but I now think it was a missed opportunity to bring Bruce Wayne into the wealthier side of The Penguin's public face and explore that.

I've never thought about this before, but that's actually a great suggestion. I liked the fact we got to see Bruce meet Napier in the first film, and it would have been cool to have a similar scene with Cobblepot in this movie. It would have added extra symmetry to the "thing's change" scene, like the two mistletoe scenes had.

I agree.  In view of their similar backgrounds it's odd that the Penguin/Oswald is one of the few villains who has no connection to Bruce Wayne outside of their 'in costume' confrontations.  It's a shame that Oswald never appeared during Max's meeting with Bruce.  Another mid-film party scene or social gathering of some type would also have been a welcome way to get all the main characters interacting in a room together in their day-to-day guises.  Alternatively, perhaps Bruce could show up at an 'Oswald for mayor' rally and publicly question the candidate's intentions.

[zDBZ]

Instead of the "kill the firstborns" plan being stopped so abruptly to make way for the penguin army, I'd combine the two: the penguins are sent out to blow things up and distract the cops while the Circus Gang steals the children. Batman would save the kids and take them to Gordon, clearing his name in the process, then head underground to shut the penguins down.

This wouldn't have been necessary, but it might have been interesting had Harvey Dent gone from DA to the mayor of Gotham; that would have brought Billy Dee back and made it harder for them to drop him in the future.

[Edd Grayson]

Here's another idea: make Penguin have Schreck's role (as in make him an aristocrat from the get-go and not the sewer monster)and add Harvey Dent and Sal Maroni to the mix.

[KeatonisBatman]

I don't know if I'd change it so much as to just tone down Max Shreck's role.  I remember Siskel and Ebert saying "Max Shreck shouldn't even be in this picture"... but I can see why they used him as a catalyst to trigger the emergence of Catwoman and help Penguin's rise to glory.  I think they were forgetting that Penguin had Max by the balls right from the get go... I guess Penguin never really expected Max to walk out on him, and he must've figured if he was going to go down that Max would go with him. 

I like the "thrown away down the sewer" aspect that Burton gave the Penguin.  It made him tragic of course, and I think gives one a little bit of sympathy for the character (just like the awesome Mr. Freeze from BTAS - you feel for the guy).  I don't know how else Burton could've made Catwoman come to light (or life)... but it seems to me that if Penguin was just an aristocrat and Catwoman had been just a cat burglar/thief that you'd end up with a possibly less interesting film, and something more similar to what Nolan perhaps would've done. 

[The Laughing Fish]

Instead of the "kill the firstborns" plan being stopped so abruptly to make way for the penguin army, I'd combine the two: the penguins are sent out to blow things up and distract the cops while the Circus Gang steals the children. Batman would save the kids and take them to Gordon, clearing his name in the process, then head underground to shut the penguins down.

That is a great idea! I always thought that the scene where Vincent Schiavelli being pulled up by Batman only - for the scene to be cut off right to the next one to be very underwhelming. Having the two subplots intertwine would have made some great tension.

Now, I may have said that Returns is my second favourite live action Batman movie, but if I was forced to make only one significant change, then I would agree with others into giving Harvey Dent a more prominent role that would pave the way for Two-Face in the sequel. I liked zDBZ's idea of Dent becoming a mayor, but maybe if Dent was in the running of an election campaign against Cobblepot, and Cobblepot had him disfigured by corrupt police officials, then maybe it could convincingly transform Dent into his Two-Face persona for a sequel.

I'd also show Batman coming to terms that his thirst for vengeance isn't improving his state of mind, just to make his condemnation of Catwoman's stance over the law in the end more understandable.

Another thing, I'd add that bit between Gordon and the Mayor in the ending of the comic adaptation -

Mayor: "You'll think he'll ever forgive us [for believing Batman was responsible for the Ice Princess' murder]?"

Gordon: "No. But he'll always be there for us."

By the way, the dialogue was said by the other way around, but I thought Gordon saying "he'll always be there for us" makes more sense since he always stayed loyal to Batman.

[johnnygobbs]

I don't think we should have got the Bat-signal at the end.  Keep Batman a fugitive and still wanted for questioning regarding the Ice Princess's murder.  Batman 3 could then be partly about Batman trying to clear and restore his name, possibly with the assistance of Harvey Dent who might not be DA anymore but is instead a regular defence attorney working against the current regime.  Bring back Catwoman too.  She's the only one who can really clear Batman's name and it will allow for further scope into their relationship.