To what extent can Burtons films be classed as 'Film Noir'?

[Batman999]

Are the 2 (brilliant) tim burton movies film noir or not? if so what elements about them are noir?

do u think it is a good idea for the next 'reboot' of batman to be in a noir style or shud they steer away from that.


personally i want a really film noir batman film, very dark and very disturbing!!

[thecolorsblend]

There are silhouettes in B89, the right type of lighting, crime/mob figures, a conclusion (for Jack anyway) in the right kind of visually complex setting and a fairly morally ambiguous hero. On the other hand, there are no voiceovers, nobody gets slipped a mickey that I can recall, a fairly virtuous female lead/love interest and, when all's said and done, is basically a thrill ride rather than the parade of hopelessness that is true of a lot of noir.

In my view, B89 touches on a lot of elements and trappings of noir but I don't think it would be accurate to call it full on noir.

[The Laughing Fish]

I'd say Returns was more of Burton-inspired movie than '89. Returns had more of Burton's trademark Gothic  influences in German expressionism than film noir (i.e. Penguin's shadow as he walks through the sewers). Whereas '89 looked set in a more 1930s-40s era art deco setting, hence the noir feel. I honestly think the closest thing I can see that resembles anything Gothic in '89 is the Batmobile driving through the woods, and the odd Gargoyle in the Cathedral. Otherwise I'd honestly say it's the least recognizable film that Burton has ever made, unlike Returns.

[Catwoman]

ok i'm going to make myself look really dumb (that doesn't require a comment from YOU The Dark Knight) but what does film noir mean? 

[thecolorsblend]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Film_noir

[Catwoman]

i seeeee....hm.

[The Laughing Fish]

Here's an interesting observation: according to biographer Ken Hanke, B89 would have been a more of a homage to classical film noir if Vicki Vale was more of a femme fatale rather than a damsel in distress.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman_%281989%29#Themes