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This thread, as the title suggests, is for all things related to Frank Herbert's Dune. The books, the David Lynch movie, the Westwood Studios videogames, the TV miniseries and the upcoming film adaptation directed by Denis Villeneuve.

I used to be a big fan of Herbert's Dune novels and read the entire series when I was a teenager. The original book is clearly the best and remains one of the greatest sci-fi novels ever written. God Emperor of Dune is my second favourite book in the series, followed by Children of Dune and Heretics of Dune. I rate Dune Messiah and Chapterhouse: Dune as the worst of the bunch and have a low opinion of both.

I own some of the sequel and prequel books written by Herbert's son and Kevin J. Anderson, but have never really gotten into them. While the original 1965 book is a masterpiece, the quality of the series as a whole is very inconsistent. If you're new to the Dune universe, my recommendation is to simply read the first book and not worry about the sequels or prequels.

As far as previous screen versions go, I admit I love the David Lynch film. It's a total train wreck of a movie, but it has such a unique ambience and artistic vision that I can't help but like it. The soundtrack is excellent and for the most part I like how Lynch and his team visualised Herbert's universe. The performances range from solid to hilariously over the top, and the quality of the special effects is equally variable. But still, I love it.

I'm less fond of the TV miniseries from 2000. Some of the visuals are nice, but other than that it's forgettable.

The Children of Dune miniseries is better. Only the second and third episodes are actually based on Children of Dune, while the first is an adaptation of Dune Messiah. Overall, it's ok.

Then there are the Dune videogames. Dune II (1992) helped define the real-time strategy genre and is often cited as one of the most influential games ever made.

Westwood Studios, who also made the Command & Conquer series, would go on to produce sequels such as Dune 2000 and Emperor: Battle for Dune. I still have my copy of Emperor: Battle for Dune. I was always more of a console gamer than a PC gamer, but this is one PC game I played extensively back in the day.

I have my doubts about whether Dune can ever be successfully translated to screen. So much of what makes the book great lies in abstract ideas and internal musings that are difficult to express on film. But if any filmmaker can do it, Denis Villeneuve might be the guy. He directed two of the best proper science fiction films of the past decade with Arrival (2016) and Blade Runner 2049 (2017). Dividing The Hobbit into three films was a terrible idea, but dividing Dune into two might just be the key to making it work. The first images have appeared online in the last few days, and so far it looks promising.

Are there any other Dune fans on the site? Is anyone else looking forward to the new film? With Star Wars and Star Trek both dying a slow death, it's time we had a new science fiction film series to restore dignity to the genre. Dune should accomplish this, provided Villeneuve doesn't drop the ball.

Most of you have probably heard about this already, but DC is launching a new comic featuring the B:TAS iteration of Batman. It's essentially a continuation of The Batman Adventures comics many of us read back in the nineties. The first issue launched digitally on April 1st and Kevin Conroy will be performing a live reading of it on Instagram later today. This is scheduled for 10am PT/1pm ET, which is 6pm for those of us in the UK.

I thoroughly enjoyed the Twin Peaks Watch Party yesterday, and this looks like it could be an equally fun way for fans to come together and pass the time celebrating something they love. If you want to read along, you can purchase a digital copy of #1 here: https://www.dccomics.com/comics/batman-the-adventures-continue-2020/batman-the-adventures-continue-1

If you'd rather just listen, you can tune in to the live performance on DC's Instagram page: https://www.instagram.com/dccomics/

Director Matt Reeves has commented on two of his favourite Batman films during an interview with Nerdist.

"I thought, 'Well, there's been some terrific Batman movies,' and I don't want to be part of a long line of Batman movies where this is just another one. I feel like they've been really distinctive. The best ones have been incredible. What Nolan did was incredible. What Tim Burton did was really singular."

On Batman Returns:

"I love Batman Returns. Michelle Pfeiffer was incredible. I love it, I love it so much. It's so incredible and she's so incredible in it. I just think it's such a beautiful movie. I love the Penguin stuff when he's going down the sewers as the baby. It's just like, wow. This is the beautiful thing about Tim Burton at his best in that way that he's got that connection into the fantastical that feels very, very personal."

On The Dark Knight:

"The Dark Knight is so incredible and I think that Heath Ledger's performance and their conception of the Joker in that movie is indelible. And the battle that he engaged with, you know, with Batman/Bruce is incredible. But the thing you take away from it more than anything is that conception, specifically, I think of the Joker. That movie is so much about how it's a horrifying thing to stare into the abyss, that idea of that level of nihilism. The whole idea that there was nothing you could do because even in the destruction of him, you were fulfilling his aims. It was just a terrifying notion that speaks to an aspect of human nature and that was really profound."

https://nerdist.com/article/matt-reeves-batman-returns-dark-knight/?amp&__twitter_impression=true

This fellow has good taste. If his own film draws inspiration from the finest qualities of BR and TDK, then we should be in for a treat.

Let's wrap up our comic-to-screen analyses of Sam Raimi's Spider-Man trilogy with a look at the final entry in the series. You can check out the comic influences on the first two films in the following threads if you haven't already done so:

Spider-Man (2002) https://www.batman-online.com/forum/index.php?topic=3590.0
Spider-Man 2 (2004) https://www.batman-online.com/forum/index.php?topic=3861.0

As with the previous two films, Raimi once again emphasised the importance of the source material.

"What wasn't set up by the first two pictures was really influenced greatly from all the great writers and artists of the Marvel comic books of the first 45 years."

https://www.superherohype.com/features/93443-spider-man-3-interviews-director-sam-raimi

Raimi explained that one of his reasons for using Sandman was the character's relatively simplistic back story, which he felt could be expanded without angering the comic fans.

"We chose a villain that did not have such a detailed back story that I would be in defiance with those comic book fans [...] The Sandman I always thought was a great visual character and could be a formidable foe against Spider-Man from all the great Marvel comic books and yet his background so detailed or defined that this would be in conflict."

https://www.superherohype.com/features/93443-spider-man-3-interviews-director-sam-raimi

Raimi was initially reluctant to include Venom, but did so after studying his comic book origins at the behest of producer Avi Arad.

"Once we finished the story, Avi our producer and partner and the former head of Marvel comic books, said, "Sam listen, you are so aware of all of these '70s villains, but you really need to incorporate Venom into this story because the fans really love Venom and don't be so selfish with villains that you know and love." So I said, "okay." I didn't understand that much about Venom because I hadn't really read as a kid. So I went to school on Venom and Avi taught me a lot about Venom and then Alvin Sargent, our screenwriter, he really was the voice of Venom and the writing of the screenplay and he showed me who he was. Then Topher Grace brought another life to the character until finally I had to go to school on all of these people being my teacher as to who he was and trying to satisfy the comic book fans and incorporate Venom into the story."

https://www.superherohype.com/features/93443-spider-man-3-interviews-director-sam-raimi

The black suit storyline in Spider-Man 3 is adapted from the 'Alien Costume Saga' that ran from May 1984 to April 1985. This arc had previously been adapted as a three-part storyline in the first season of Spider-Man: The Animated Series titled 'The Alien Costume' (later released on DVD as Spider-Man: The Venom Saga). The Spider-Man: The Animated Series version of this story was subsequently adapted as a comic in Spider-Man Adventures Vol 1 #8-10 (July-September 1995). Raimi's movie lifts elements from all three of these sources, as well as the first Venom storyline in the Ultimate Spider-Man comics.

Many have observed similarities between Raimi's Spider-Man films and the first three Christopher Reeve Superman movies, and in keeping with those comparisons we can identify several parallels between Richard Lester's Superman III (1983) and the final entry in Raimi's trilogy. The plots of both films see the hero being infected by an alien substance that causes him to turn bad. In both films the hero is introduced to a new love interest (Lana/Gwen), and in both stories he must conquer his inner darkness and do battle against a foe who is a shadowy reflection of himself.

The movie picks up shortly after the events of Spider-Man 2. Things seem to be going well in Peter's life and Mary Jane is living her dream of acting on Broadway. Mary Jane also pursued an acting career in the comics and at one point moved to the West Coast to find work in Hollywood.

One of the movie's subplots concerns Peter's friendship with Gwen Stacy and Mary Jane's resultant jealousy. Gwen first appeared in the comics in 'If This Be My Destiny...!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #31, December 1965). In both the comics and the movie she is depicted as a classmate of Peter's at university. Her role in the movie – coming between Peter and M.J. – is similar to Felicia Hardy's role in the 'Alien Costume Saga'.

Early in the film we see Harry emerging from a chamber in his father's old hideout after dosing himself with the Green Goblin formula. The following panels are from 'Final Judgement' (The Spectacular Spider-Man Vol 1 #188, May 1992).

A mask can be seen in Harry's hideout resembling the one worn by the comic villain Hobgoblin. Prior to the film's release, there was online speculation that Harry's costumed persona might be based on Hobgoblin rather than the Green Goblin guise worn by his father.

Following this scene we are introduced to one of the movie's other main villains: Flint Marko, aka the Sandman. It's established straight off the bat that the cinematic version of Marko has a sympathetic motive for his crimes: he needs to raise money to fund his sick daughter's medical treatment. By contrast, the comic book Marko never had a wife or biological daughter and was a much nastier and far less sympathetic character. He debuted in 'Nothing Can Stop... the Sandman!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #4, September 1963).

Elsewhere Peter and Mary Jane are watching a meteor shower in the park. It is during this scene that the alien Symbiote crashes to Earth. The Symbiote first appeared in 'Homecoming!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #252, May 1984), though it's first chronological appearance was in 'Invasion!' (Marvel Super Heroes Secret Wars Vol 1 #8, December 1984).

In the comics it was Peter himself who brought the Symbiote back to Earth after he discovered it on Battleworld. The Spider-Man: The Animated Series episode 'The Alien Costume, Part I' (s01e08) presents a different sequence of events where John Jameson brings the Symbiote to Earth after finding it on an asteroid. Supposedly earlier treatments of the Spider-Man 3 script also had John bringing the Symbiote to Earth, but the idea was later dropped in favour of having it arrive during a meteor shower. Ruben Fleischer's Venom (2018) would later use John Jameson's space mission to explain how the Symbiote reached Earth.

Following the scene in the park, Harry makes his costumed debut as New Goblin. Harry first fought Peter as the Green Goblin in 'The Green Goblin Lives Again!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #136, September 1974).

The cover of this issue shows Peter and Harry fighting on the latter's Goblin Glider like they do during their first battle in the film.

The fight ends with Harry sustaining an injury that leaves him with amnesia. The same thing happened to the Green Goblin in the comics, only it was Norman Osborn that lost his memory rather than Harry. This happened after the Green Goblin battled Spider-Man in 'Spidey Saves the Day!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #40, September 1966).

Norman would remain an amnesiac for several years before finally regaining his memory in 'The Goblin Lives!' (Amazing Spider-Man Annual Vol 1 #9, June 1973). Similarly Harry takes a while to recover his memory in the movie.

The scene where Marko is transformed into Sandman is more or less faithful to his origin story in Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #4. In both versions he is being chased by the police at night when he stumbles onto an experimental test site.

In the comic he is exposed to radiation from a nuclear blast, while in the movie he is caught in a particle accelerator.

Following the test, Marko is able to rearrange his molecules like grains of sand in order to alter his physical shape.

Gwen's father, Captain George Stacy, has a supporting role in the film. He first appeared in 'Disaster!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #56, January 1968).

The scenes of Mr. Ditkovitch harassing Peter about his rent money recall Peter's landlady, Mrs. Muggins, giving him similar grief in the comics. The following panel is from 'Even a Ghost Can Fear the Night!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #255, August 1984), which was part of the 'Alien Costume Saga'.

Another addition to the cast is Eddie Brock Jr. Brock, or rather Venom, was first glimpsed in the comics in 'The Longest Road!' (Web of Spider-Man Vol 1 #18, September 1986), though his first proper appearance was in 'Survival of the Hittest!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #299, April 1988).

In the comics Eddie Brock was depicted as muscular before he bonded with the Symbiote, while in the film he's shown to have a more average build. In the comics Eddie wasn't evil before becoming Venom and his fall from grace was a result of genuine error. By contrast, the movie version is portrayed as dishonest from the get go and his fall from grace is a direct consequence of his own lies. The movie Brock's lean physical appearance and slimy personality are closer to the Ultimate Spider-Man version of the character than the 616 incarnation.

The film's characterisation of Brock is also heavily indebted to the version from Spider-Man: The Animated Series. In the TV show Brock is portrayed as an ambitious photojournalist who sucks up to Jameson and secures a job at The Daily Bugle by helping J.J. make Spider-Man look bad. The panel below is from 'The Alien Costume' (Spider-Man Adventures Vol 1 #8, July 1995).

In the film Eddie is romantically involved with Gwen Stacy. They were also briefly attached in the Ultimate Spider-Man comics. The panel below is from 'Inheritance' (Ultimate Spider-Man Vol 1 #34, March 2003).

The scene where Spider-Man saves Gwen from falling to her death recalls the 'The Night Gwen Stacy Died' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #121, June 1973). In the comic Peter accidentally snapped Gwen's neck when he tried to stop her fall using his webbing. There's a moment in the movie where he fires his webbing down towards her as she plummets, but instead of grabbing Gwen with it he uses the web to catapult himself off some rubble and safely catch her in his arms.

The movie scene where Spider-Man saves Gwen is closer to the comic 'What If Gwen Stacy Had Lived?' (What If? Vol 1 #24, December 1980), in which Peter leaps after Gwen and safely catches her instead of using his web.

Spider-Man creator Stan Lee has a brief exchange with Peter during his final cameo of the trilogy. His line "'Nuff said" is a reference to one of the catchphrases he regularly used in his 'Bullpen Bulletin' editorials.

Sandman is able to travel on the wind by turning himself into sand particles. The following panels are from Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #4.

Spider-Man's first fight with Sandman contains several visual references to Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #4. In both stories Spider-Man tries punching Sandman in the stomach when he first meets him, only for his fist to go through Marko's torso.

Sandman is able to enlarge his hand.

He also turns his hands into giant mallets.

Their first encounter in both the movie and the comics ends with Sandman making a clean getaway.

Peter meets with Mary Jane at a restaurant where he intends to propose. However Mary Jane becomes jealous of Peter's friendship with Gwen and suspects there's something romantic between them. Similar tensions arose in the Ultimate Spider-Man comics, and in both stories Peter had to deny there was anything between him and Gwen. The panel below is from 'Still' (Ultimate Spider-Man Vol 1 #37, May 2003), which was part of the Venom storyline.

Mary Jane's jealousy of Gwen also echoes her jealousy of Peter's relationship with Black Cat during the 'Alien Costume Saga'. The panels below are from 'The Sinister Secret of Spider-Man's New Costume!' (Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #258, November 1984).

The plotline about Peter seeking revenge against Marko for Uncle Ben's death is original to the movie, though it does recall his vendetta against Sin-Eater in 'The Death of Jean DeWolff' story arc (Peter Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man Vol 1 #107–110, October 1985–January 1986). I'll come back to this later.

The scene where the Symbiote takes control of Peter while he sleeps is adapted from the aforementioned Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #255.

In the comic Spider-Man then goes out in the Symbiote suit while Peter continues to sleep inside it. Afterwards he has no memory of where he went. This was adapted in the Spider-Man: The Animated Series episode 'The Alien Costume, Part I', which in turn was heavily referenced in Raimi's movie. The animated version of the scene has Peter waking up in the black suit while hanging upside down in front of a skyscraper with no memory of how he got there. The movie recreates this scene practically shot-for-shot. In both the cartoon and the film, this marks the first time Peter wears the black suit.

The scene in the movie where the Symbiote first engulfs Peter also resembles a scene from ''Til Death Do Us Part!' (Web of Spider-Man Vol 1 #1, April 1985). In the comic the Symbiote tracks Peter to his apartment after the two have separated and stealthily attaches itself to him, much like it does in the movie.

In both stories Peter doesn't realise what is happening until he sees his reflection.

The following comparison is with a scene from Web of Spider-Man Vol 1 #1. In both the comic and the movie, this scene occurs right after the Symbiote has bonded itself with Spider-Man back in Peter's apartment.

While wearing the Symbiote suit in the comics, Peter no longer needed his web shooters. Instead he was able to project organic webbing with the aid of the suit. This may have inspired the organic web shooters in Raimi's films. In both the comics and the movie, the ability to fire organic webs was subsequently passed on to Eddie Brock when he bonded with the Symbiote.

In the movie Peter asks Dr. Connors to examine the Symbiote. In the original 616 story he asked Reed Richards to examine it, as depicted in Amazing Spider-Man Vol 1 #258. However in Spider-Man: The Animated Series he asked Dr. Connors to check it out for him. The following panels are from 'The Alien Costume, Part 2: Paint it Black!' (Spider-Man Adventures Vol 1 #9, July 1995).

God of War Art Director Raf Grassetti has created renderings of several classic Batman: The Animated Series characters. He's also expressed hope that Warner Bros will one day produce a CG animated Batman film in this style.

The first connection to highlight between The King of Comedy and Joker is the involvement of Martin Scorsese in both films. Scorsese directed TKOC and was at one point attached to produce Joker before eventually departing from the project. The influence of his work, and particularly TKOC, is plainly visible in the finished product.

Both films are set against a grounded urban backdrop during the early 1980s. The main character in both movies is an aspiring comic who lives with his mother (in the case of TKOC, his mother might be a figment of his imagination). Both characters wear a red suit when they appear on television towards the end of the film.

Rupert Pupkin, like Arthur Fleck, is obsessed with a late night talk show host: Jerry Langford/Murray Franklin.

Pupkin in TKOC is portrayed by Robert De Niro, who also plays Murray in Joker. Rupert/Arthur fantasises about interacting with Jerry/Murray, and we see these delusions play out on screen. The line between fantasy and reality is blurred in both films.

Rupert/Arthur even role-plays imaginary interviews with his idol in the privacy of his home.

At one point Rupert/Arthur performs his stand-up routine, but his words are drowned out with non-diegetic audio so we don't get to hear his act.

Rupert/Arthur falls in love with an attractive woman and ends up drawing her into his fantasies. She eventually realises how deluded he is and is freaked out by his behaviour.

Both films contain a memorable scene where the main character makes a work-related call from a public telephone. Neither call ends well for the protagonist.

Arthur's obsession with Thomas Wayne also has parallels with Rupert's obsession with Jerry in TKOC. At one point Rupert/Arthur makes an uninvited visit to the home of Jerry/Thomas and interacts with his butler.

In another scene Rupert/Arthur tries confronting Jerry/Thomas at a public venue and ends up being forcibly ejected from the premises by security. The scene of Arthur being thrown out of the cinema by security is absent from the theatrical cut of Joker, but was included in the trailer.

Arthur/Rupert ultimately resorts to extreme measures that entail confronting his idol with a pistol. Rupert merely kidnaps Jerry at gunpoint, while Arthur goes so far as to shoot Murray in the head.

Rupert and Arthur both achieve their dream of appearing on their idol's TV show towards the end of the film, though in doing so both perpetrate a crime that results in their incarceration. Both characters also use aliases that correspond with playing cards: Rupert uses the alias 'King' after kidnapping Jerry, while Arthur asks Murray to introduce him as 'Joker' when he appears on his show.

The final shot of the film where Joker is being chased back and forth by the Arkham staff evokes a scene in the middle of TKOC where Rupert is being chased by the security guards at Jerry's office. In both scenes we have a static shot of a hallway as the characters run in and out of shot in a comical fashion.

I'll quickly note some possible references to other films.

The scene where Arthur is posturing with the gun in his apartment has obvious similarities with the famous "You talking to me?" scene from Martin Scorsese's Taxi Driver (1976). Both films focus on a mentally-unstable loner whose obsessive behaviour includes stalking and ultimately leads to violence.

Some of the visuals in Joker are indebted to Paul Leni's The Man Who Laughs (1928), such as the scenes of Arthur applying his makeup in front of a mirror, or the scenes where he's simultaneously laughing and crying.

There are some notable similarities between Arthur Fleck and Norman Bates in Alfred Hitchcock's Psycho (1960). Both are shy, isolated and sexually unfulfilled men who are loyally devoted to their mother until they snap and commit matricide. Both have previously spent time in a mental institute, having suffered abuse at the hands of their mother, and both become fixated on a young woman whom they eventually kill (or so it's implied in Joker). Arthur discovers that Penny is not his biological mother but instead someone who adopted him at a young age. Norman discovers the same thing in Richard Franklin's Psycho II (1983) when his biological mother shows up and tells him the truth about the woman who raised him. After learning the truth, Norman and Arthur both proceed to murder their mothers in cold blood.

William Friedkin's The French Connection (1971) has been cited as another cinematic influence. The sequence in Friedkin's film where Charnier eludes his police tail by boarding a train foreshadows a similar scene in Joker where Arthur boards a train to escape the police officers who are following him.

Sidney Lumet's Dog Day Afternoon (1975) has also been cited as an influence on Joker. In both films, the criminal acts of the main protagonist inadvertently inspire the sympathies of the public to an extent that crowds assemble on the streets to cheer them on.

Another Sidney Lumet film, Network (1976), ends with one of the main characters, a provocative television personality, being shot dead in front of a live audience while recording his TV show. The film then cuts to a bank of television screens showing different channels as the news of his assassination is reported, exactly like Joker does after Murray's death.

I'm sure there are other films referenced in Joker. If anyone can think of any, add them to this thread.

[The Dark Knight Returns]

Director Todd Phillips has said Joker (2019) was not based on any one particular comic, but lifted elements from several different stories:

"It's funny, because a lot of you guys have probably reprinted something I said in Empire, where I was misquoted. I'm not gonna complain. I like the writer--he wrote a great piece, where I said, 'We didn't take anything from the comic book world.'

"That's actually not what I said. What I said was, 'We didn't take anything from one particular comic.' We kind of picked and chose what we liked from the 80-year canon of Joker."

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/joker-director-says-he-was-misquoted-concerning-co/1100-6469859/

In addition to the title character, several other familiar faces from the source material appear in the movie: Bruce Wayne, Thomas Wayne, Martha Wayne, their faithful butler Alfred and a character who is presumably meant to be Joe Chill. We also have a number of characters that are ostensibly new, but strongly resemble pre-existing figures from the comics.

Three stories in particular seem to have influenced the film: Frank Miller's The Dark Knight Returns (1986), Alan Moore's The Killing Joke (1988) and J. M. DeMatteis' 'Going Sane' (Batman: Legends of the Dark Knight Vol 1 #65-68, November 1994-February 1995). The comic creators responsible for all three of these stories are acknowledged in the 'thanks' section of the movie's end credits. So let's look at each in turn and see what the film took from them.

The Dark Knight Returns

The main thing to be adapted from this story is the climactic interview scene on the Murray Franklin show. Joker appears before the audience by stepping through a curtain with a cigarette in his right hand.

His fellow guest on the show is a female doctor. In The Dark Knight Returns the other guest is meant to be real life sex therapist Dr Ruth Westheimer, better known as 'Dr Ruth', while in the movie she's replaced by a fictional substitute named Dr Sally. In both stories the Joker suddenly kisses her on the lips.

Joker shocks the audience with a violent revelation. They're not sure if he's serious or just kidding.

And of course the interview climaxes with him murdering Endochrine/Franklin. In the comic he also kills Dr Wolper, which may have inspired the final scene in the film where it's implied he murders his therapist at Arkham.

Joker is shown smoking a cigarette in Arkham in both stories.

The depiction of the Wayne murders includes the familiar image of the gunman (presumably Joe Chill) tearing off Martha's pearl necklace.

The Killing Joke

The most obvious similarity between TKJ and the movie is that both present origin stories for the Joker in which he is portrayed as a failed stand-up comedian. The character's name is not mentioned in TKJ, though Batman: Gotham Knights Vol 1 #54 (August 2004) would later reveal it to be Jack. In the film his name is Arthur Fleck.

Both characters are victimised by the lowlifes of Gotham, and these experiences contribute to their descent into despair and madness.

Both characters live with a female family member who dies during the course of the story. In the comic it's his wife, while in the movie it's his adoptive mother.

The Joker is shown to dance gleefully in TKJ, much like he does throughout the film.

Arthur's line "I had a bad day" was almost certainly inspired by one of the Joker's lines in TKJ:

"All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy."

The film presents Arthur as an unreliable narrator, and in the final act it is revealed that some of the things we witnessed, such as his romantic relationship with Rebecca, did not actually happen. This recalls something the Joker says regarding his memories in TKJ:

"Something like that happened to me, you know. I... I'm not exactly sure what it was. Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another... If I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"

'Going Sane'

In this story the Joker adopts the name Joseph Kerr and reverts to a relatively normal life after he thinks he's killed Batman. His troubled civilian life has parallels with Arthur Fleck's in the movie. For one thing, both men are on medication and are said to have had prior mental health problems. Arthur's appearance is similar to Joe Staton's depiction of Joseph in the comic.

Both Joseph and Arthur fall in love with a neighbour they meet in a hallway of their apartment building. This woman lives a few doors down from Joseph/Arthur. The character of Rebecca Brown was probably at least partly inspired by Sophie Dumond in DeMatteis' story.

Arthur/Joseph is shown to occasionally laugh uncontrollably during times of emotional stress.

Both stories feature scenes where the Joker watches a Charlie Chaplin film in a cinema.

Both stories also contain an image of Joseph/Arthur mentally transforming into the Joker as elevator doors slide open/shut in front of him.

Other Possible Comic Influences

A prominent subplot in the film concerns Thomas Wayne running for mayor of Gotham. Thomas also ran for mayor in Batman: Earth One Volume 1 (2012).

The idea of the Joker's actions inspiring protestors in clown masks might have been inspired by 'Wheel of Misfortune' (Detective Comics Vol 2 #5, March 2012). There was also a similar subplot during the Death of the Family (2012-13) arc.

Towards the end of the film the Joker's actions inspire a riot that leads directly to the deaths of Thomas and Martha Wayne. The Joker had previously been shown to be responsible for the deaths of Batman's parents in the comic stories 'The Danger of the Deadly Duo!' (World's Finest Vol 1 #166, May 1967), Batman: Dark Joker the Wild (1994) and Batman: Detective No. 27 (2003), as well as in Tim Burton's 1989 Batman movie.

The detail of the blood splattered across Bruce's face after his parents are gunned down recalls Jim Lee's artwork in 'The Legend of the Batman: Who He Is and How He Came to Be', which was included in the trade paperback edition of Hush.

Irv Novick is one of the comic creators listed in the 'thanks' section of the film's credits. The scrawny appearance of Phoenix's Joker recalls Novick's work on The Joker Vol 1 series that ran in the late seventies. The Joker was often shown dancing in this series, much like Phoenix's version does in the film.

'99 and 99/100% Dead' (Joker Vol 1 #10, written and drawn in the seventies but unpublished until August 2019) ends with the Joker murdering the psychiatrist he'd been speaking with throughout the issue, similar to how it's implied he may have murdered his therapist at the end of the movie.

The following comparison is with a panel from 'Luthor – You're Driving Me Sane!' (Joker Vol 1 #7, June 1976).

One last possible comic influence relates to the character Gary, who is one of the few people Arthur seems to genuinely like in the movie. The comic book Joker has occasionally displayed a fondness for vertically-challenged sidekicks and had several such henchmen in The Killing Joke. He also had a midget accomplice named Gaggy who was his sidekick in the comics before Harley Quinn came along. Like Gary, Gaggy was a vertically-challenged clown who was friends with the Joker. He first appeared in the Silver Age story 'The Joker's Original Robberies!' (Batman Vol 1 #186, November 1966) and was later referenced in numerous Modern Age comics. Actor Leigh Gill, who portrays Gary in the film, has acknowledged the similarities between the two characters on social media.

Earlier Batman Films

In a possible nod to the bat-poles from the sixties TV show and movie, Bruce's tree house is shown to have a sliding pole.

Thomas Gainsborough's 'Boy in Blue' (1770) can be seen on the wall of Arthur's apartment. This was one of the paintings defaced by the Joker and his goons in the 1989 Batman movie.

After killing Murray Franklin, the Joker shoots his corpse as it sits slumped behind his desk. He did the same thing after killing Carl Grissom in the 1989 film.

The exterior of stately Wayne Manor was filmed at the Webb Institute in Glen Cove, New York, which was the same location used for the stately Wayne Manor exteriors in the Joel Schumacher Batman films and the Gotham TV show.

Phoenix thanked his friend Heath Ledger during his acceptance speech at the Golden Globes, and Joker (2019) appears to have derived a fair amount of influence from The Dark Knight (2008). The nihilistic worldview of the Phoenix Joker reflects that of the Ledger version. He also shares his long hair and use of makeup instead of perma-white skin. The image of the Joker holding the camera as he speaks directly to the people of Gotham appears in both films.

The scene where Joker is enjoying a ride in the back of a police car evokes a memorable moment from The Dark Knight.

The Joker smearing blood across his lips to create a smile recalls a teaser poster for The Dark Knight featuring Ledger's Joker.

Arthur's journal may have been inspired by the Joker diary Ledger kept during the making of The Dark Knight. Both books contain notes on things the Joker finds funny, but which most people would find disturbing. In the case of Ledger's Joker diary, many of these things were copied from Grant Morrison's 'The Clown at Midnight' (Batman Vol 1 #663, April 2007).

And that's all I've got. Can anyone think of anything else worth mentioning?

Here's our first look at the new Batmobile.

I don't know if there are many fans of old movie serials on this site, but I thought this one certainly deserved its own thread.

Unlike the Batman serials, the 1948 Superman begins with a leisurely-paced depiction of the title character's origin story. This established a precedent where Superman adaptations would begin with his origin, while most Batman films and TV shows would begin with the title character already established.

The Kryptonian capital in the first chapter exhibits an art deco futurist architectural style. This was the aesthetic guys like Tim Burton and Paul Dini were trying to recapture in the early nineties. I love it!

Superman's origin story in the serial very much reflects the early Golden Age Earth-Two comics. The Kryptonians are said to be a race of Supermen, all of whom possess the same powers as Kal-El. Their sun is blue rather than red, which suggests it's far younger than the Rao of later comics.

The same animators behind the Fleischer Studios shorts were responsible for the scene where Krypton blows up, as well as the Superman flying sequences.

This serial (or the radio series it was adapted from) established the idea of Clark's first trial being a tornado tearing through his hometown. The tornado scenario would be revisited in comics such as Jeph Loeb's A Superman for All Seasons and Geoff Johns' Superman: Secret Origin, as well as the first season finale of Smallville. In the film serial Clark saves his father's life during the tornado. I wonder if this inspired Jonathan Kent's death scene in Man of Steel.

The 1948 serial also set the precedent of navigating Kal-El's back story in three leaps: his infancy, his teenage years, and finally his young adulthood. The first episode of the fifties TV show would also do this, as did the 1978 film and Man of Steel.

This serial marks the debut of Noel Neill as Lois Lane. Between the movie serials and the fifties TV show, Neill must have played Lois more times than any other actress. In her youth she bore a striking resemblance to Jessica Jones star Krysten Ritter.

The first time we see Lois in the 1948 serial she's sat on a train, with Jimmy Olsen occupying the seat opposite her. When Neill appeared as Lois's mother in the 1978 Superman film she was also sat on a train, only then the opposite seat was occupied by Kirk Alyn. In both scenes Neil's character is sat on the left side of the frame. Did Donner do this on purpose as a nod to her debut scene in the serial?

Superman holding the railway track in place as the train passes by in the second chapter foreshadows a similar moment in Superman: The Movie.

Both scenes reflect a memorable moment from 'The Dam' (Action Comics Vol 1 #5, October 1938).

Perry and Jimmy also appear. You could make a drinking game based on the number of time Jimmy gets beaten up. He seems to get knocked out in almost every chapter.

Kryptonite is introduced in the third chapter. The scene where Clark is first exposed to it is almost identical to a scene in the Lois & Clark episode 'The Green, Green Glow of Home' where Cain's version gets his first dose of k-radiation.

The scenes of Lois trying to scoop Clark also foreshadow the rivalry between Cain and Hatcher's characters in the first season of Lois & Clark. There's a scene in one of the film serial's chapters where Lois lends Clark her car and then reports it as stolen. That's exactly the kind of thing Hatcher's Lois would have done in the nineties.

The villain is a generic masked femme fatale known as the Spider Lady. In all fairness, the comic book Superman's gallery of rogues wasn't terribly impressive at this time. So it's not as if they had a lot of villains to choose from. The entrance to the Spider Lady's secret hideout was filmed in Bronson Canyon, the same location used for the Batcave entrance in the 1966 Batman movie and TV show.

Superman outfoxes the Spider Lady in the final chapter by pretending to succumb to kryptonite so one of her goons will carry him to her secret lair. He then springs to life and reveals that he's shielded himself from the harmful radiation by wearing a lead lining beneath his costume. But his hands and face remain exposed. So how was he immune to the effects of the k-radiation? I have no idea. The serial's more or less ended by that point, so there's no point overthinking it.

To be brutally honest, I was never that impressed by Alyn's performance as Superman. He had a good physical build for the part, and his costume was decent, but there's something wooden about his take on the character. The serial feels rather like a dry run for The Adventures Superman TV series. And considering Alyn's second Superman serial was released just two years before George Reeves' debut, I find it impossible not to compare the two. But to my mind, Reeves was the superior actor and brought a whole new level of charisma to the role. Alyn had a more comic-accurate physique, but he didn't have Reeves' relaxed screen presence.

I also think Alyn's performance compares unfavourably to Bud Collyer's. Alyn had a weird way of delivering the "This looks like a job for SOOperman!" line where he almost sounded as though he was trying not to laugh. By contrast, Collyer would typically drop his voice an octave midsentence to make Superman sound more masculine than Clark. Alyn's Superman is lacking those humorous touches.

So as far as ranking the Golden Age Superman actors goes, I'd definitely place Alyn below Collyer and Reeves. Then again, Collyer and Reeves were exceptionally good in the role. I don't mean any disrespect to Alyn. I don't think he was bad in the role. Just adequate. The most memorable performance in the 1948 serial comes from Neill, and it's not hard to see why they brought her back for the Reeves television show.

On the whole, I prefer the 1940s Batman film serials to the 1948 Superman serial. The Superman serial might have better production values, but the Batman serials were unintentionally hilarious and more exciting. Kryptonite plays a very small role in the Superman serial, and there's nothing in the story to really test Superman physically or mentally. There's also too much recycled footage of Superman taking off in an alleyway and landing back in the storeroom at the Daily Planet building. I lost count of the number of times they reused that footage. But it's still a charming and entertaining specimen of a bygone era, even though it does start to drag in the second half.

I've seen bits of Atom Man vs. Superman (1950), but I've never watched the whole thing right the way through. I'm going to try and get hold of a copy soon. Has anyone seen it, and if so is it better than the 1948 serial? Are there any fans of Alyn's Superman on this site? How do you feel the 1948 serial compares to other superhero serials of that vintage?

In light of the hostility certain sections of the media have directed towards this film, it's going to be very interesting to see how it performs during award season. Commercially, it's unquestionably been a colossal success. But will the industry celebrate the film as enthusiastically as audiences have? So far, it's off to a flying start. It won the prestigious Golden Lion Award at the Venice Film Festival last year.

And now it's won two Golden Globes. It was nominated in four categories: best dramatic performance, best score, best motion picture (drama) and best director. It won best dramatic performance and best score.

Phoenix is the third actor to be nominated for a Golden Globe for portraying the Joker, following Nicholson and Ledger. He's the second actor to win a Golden Globe for portraying the Joker, following Ledger.

Next up is the SAG Awards, where Joker has been nominated for best stunts and best lead performance. After that it's the Oscars. But feel free to use this thread to list any other nominations or awards the film might garner.

Looks like the Burtonverse Bruce ended up marrying Selina. Should we consider this canon now?

Also, Burt Ward has been pictured filming on location.

That looks like the sort of jumper Dick used to wear, and it has Robin's familiar colours. Is the dog meant to be Ace?

Mark Millar's classic Elseworlds story is finally receiving an animated adaptation. The voice cast includes Jason Isaacs as Superman, Amy Acker as Lois Lane and Diedrich Bader as Lex Luthor. Here's the first image.

Conroy's finally going to appear as Bruce in live action.

https://uk.ign.com/articles/2019/08/04/arrowverse-crisis-on-infinite-earths-crossover-batman-bruce-wayne-kevin-conroy

I get the impression whoever wrote this one actually quite liked the movie. But can anyone confirm if that 31 minute screen time figure is correct? That's just under ¼ of the movie's 126 minute runtime. Are they just counting Batman scenes or does this include Bruce Wayne scenes as well?

I'll re-title this thread when more information is available, but for now all we know is that a new Blade movie or TV show is on the way starring 2-time Oscar winner Mahershala Ali.

I'm hoping Ali will affect a London accent, since every previous Blade adaptation completely ignored the comic book character's nationality. I'm also hoping it will be R-rated, though that seems unlikely. A PG-13 Blade movie would be like a PG-13 Punisher movie. Just wrong. I always thought the Netflix format would have been perfect for Blade. They could have made it as dark and violent as they liked and featured brutal martial arts scenes on a par with Daredevil. The second half of Daredevil season 2 already touched upon the realm of supernatural horror, so the path was clear for a Blade series.

When they first announced The Defenders project, I had a theory they'd follow it up with a similar set of shows based on the Midnight Sons comics: Blade, Werewolf by Night, Ghost Rider, Morbius, Man-Thing, etc. Basically all the remaining dark characters that wouldn't fit in a PG-13 popcorn flick. But obviously that's not going to happen now. Having an actor like Ali play a prominent role in both Luke Cage and Blade more or less confirms that the Netflix shows are apocryphal anyway. Many of us suspected as much, so I can't say I'm shocked. Perhaps the rumours about a new Daredevil being introduced in Spider-Man: Leaving Home/Homesick/Home is Where the Hurt Is, or whatever it's called, have some truth to them after all.

It's interesting to see both Blade and Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness bringing the supernatural horror side of the Marvel Universe to the fore. I don't mind DS2 being PG-13, but this Blade project really needs to be R-rated. Otherwise it'll be a tough sell with the older fans. I also hope they don't start doing the whole Black Panther thing of pretending this is the first black superhero movie. That would be a disservice to the first two Snipes movies.

Overall, I'm not sure what to make of this news. I'm glad to see Blade is returning, but I'm disappointed it's not Snipes and I have concerns about how Marvel Studios might handle the project.

I don't know if anyone followed Marvel Studio's presentation at Comic-Con, but they announced several upcoming films and TV shows to kick off Phase 4. So far they've only revealed what's coming as far as 2021, but Kevin Feige confirmed other movies such as X-Men and Fantastic Four are in production. Most of the films they announced didn't particularly interest me, but this one did.

When the first Doctor Strange movie was announced there were rumours it would be Marvel Studio's first excursion into the horror genre. Scott Derrickson has made some effective horror films in the past – most notably The Exorcism of Emily Rose (2005) and Sinister (2012) – and I got hyped about the idea of a darker, scarier movie that would deviate from the standard MCU formula. The finished product was slightly darker than most other MCU films, and it certainly had a more distinctive look in terms of the cinematography and production design, but it didn't delve into Lovecraftian horror as deeply as I'd hoped it would. It crept up to the edge of the genre, but never quite crossed into it. But apparently the sequel will. Derrickson explicitly described Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness (scheduled for May 2021) as a horror movie and "the first scary MCU film". Cumberbatch said he was excited about the "twist of horror".

Derrickson also used the word "gothic" several times when describing the film. When was the last time we had a truly gothic live action superhero movie? Spider-Man 3? Hellboy 2? Daredevil '03? It's been far too long. Kevin Feige confirmed the film will be PG-13, but then so was The Exorcism of Emily Rose and that still managed to raise a few hairs. So far they're saying all the right things to get me hyped about this. We'll have to keep an eye on how it develops, but for now at least I like the direction they're heading in.

DC Comics has announced the Halloween director will take part in their 'Year of the Villain' series by writing a one-shot comic about the Joker, with the comic set to be released on October 9. Illustrations will be handled by Philip Tan and Marc Deering.

Carpenter will be co-writing the comic with Anthony Burch, who last worked with Carpenter on Big Trouble In Little China: Old Man Jack, a one-off comic that tied into the director's 1986 Kurt Russell-starring action classic.

"The Joker is the greatest villain in comics," Carpenter, who is rumoured to be executive producing two new Halloween sequels as well as composing the new films' music, said in a statement.

"This new comic puts The Joker on a mission to get his swagger back in a world gone bad by out-badding everyone else, proving that the greatest evil is always the one that leaves them laughing."

www.nme.com/news/film/horror-legend-john-carpenter-write-new-dc-joker-comic-2528535#wRWlpleE6sVpMALh.99

Brandon Routh is returning as Superman for a CW crossover:

https://deadline.com/2019/07/tyler-hoechlin-brandon-routh-superman-arrowverse-crossover-the-cw-1202649053/

Does this mean the door's open for Dean Cain to return as well? If so, let's hope they both get treated better than John Wesley Shipp's Flash.

CW shows are pure trash IMO, but I am intrigued to see Routh reprise his role after 13 years.